Feedback PvP Arena (reworked)

[lordwasa]

There is a ton of messages on here, most of which seem to be whining about plundering. Is there anything on why no rewards were seen on Monday?

I will inform about this and let you know why it hasn't been distributed

 

[Cleitomachus]

...the PVP Arena was meant as a replacement of the PVP Tower.

There is no need of diamonds in the Towers, that's the real reason for the replacement...

 

[Thunderbummy]

Still waiting for diamonds for testing this new feature or have they been removed along with the towers?????????????????

 

[Hiep Lin]

There is no need of diamonds in the Towers, that's the real reason for the replacement...

The fights against the neighbors remain.
Towers are useless, only a weekly ranking and some medals.

 

[-Alin-]

...
We listen to all of your feedback and forward it to our gamedevelopers. If you have suggestions, please share them with us, but be specific about it.

...

Inno really should implement in forum a dislike option.

„WE”-this should be Inno, „listen to all of your feedback”-that was meant to be the joke, „forward it to our game developers”-yes, you forward, but they really don't care at all.

They adjusted what they wanted, not everything was discuted after hundreds of feedbacks.

The thing much more people cared about were the towers, which obsiosly have been removed AGAIN, and we just receive a „dry” answer without any further explainations „the PVP Arena was meant as a replacement of the PVP Tower” ...
How PvP Arena(AI Arena) could replace the old PvP towers which were something else, used by many people to monitor how much fights they did in GE, GbG or GvG?
For some people being first in his era PvP Tower was something important, gives him the motivation needed to do much more fights to keep first position.

If you still consider this a „replacement” then implement something else for our loss, some lists where we can see what we did in GE(fights points ranking for guild), an ranking with all we did in neighbourghood, another list with all we did in GbG and then another one for GvG like Inno did with Global Ranking, Guild Ranking and Age ranking in AI Arena.

 

[Thunderdome]

Again, the dumpster fire that is the PVP (or so Inno claims) Arena keeps on burning...

We appreciate all of your feedback and critism so far and we will continue to communicate this to our gamedevelopers.

Based on your previous feedback we have made several changes to the Arena:
- manual battle option added
- in-game resources to buy attempts with medals
- instead of being stuck with the same opponent every day we added the ability to refresh your opponents every 2 hours
- changes to the difficulty parameters of opponents based on the opponents era
- multiple leagues / league per era (we have global, era and guild leagues, besides the seasonal goals)
- Rewards for participation
- Chances to win a prize when fighting, just like GBG

There are some things we couldn't change, like:
- Allow battles only between players online, if this was the case, you would be fighting the same oponent over and over again
- See the defense before attacking, there would be no challenge there
- We cannot allow every GB to be applicable to the PVP Arena or this feature would become unbalanced
- Keep PvP Towers, the PVP Arena was meant as a replacement of the PVP Tower

We listen to all of your feedback and forward it to our gamedevelopers. If you have suggestions, please share them with us, but be specific about it.

For your responses in the "feedback section" of your message:

• I didn't think manual button was added (didn't pay attention as I was auto'ing throughout) as I tried it out. This should have been added THE FIRST TIME after the last one.
• Now, this one I know that was in there when it first came out because I just clicked on it to see (as a curiosity). So why even have it stated if it's already been there.
• Instead of being stuck with the same opponent, how about placing that opponent out of the eyes of the player that engages for a set amount of time? The refresh is junk as it will give the same opponent a player is stuck with for the next two hours if they don't spend diamonds in doing so. Perhaps making it with medals as well... who knows.
• You had done something right (somewhat) with this one. However, I would like things well rounded if they were one age above and below (along with the same age) for each of the difficulties (easy one age below, normal same age, hard one age above) or the three ages above and below for said difficulties with normal being the same age.
• So, we have global ranking where you can be at the bottom of the barrel always. It doesn't quite show how one is advancing up the ladder. We have era, which is just one era (the one the player is in) whilst the towers had multiple eras for the player to be ranked onto depending on units used. And, we have guild which is pretty much useless in my opinion. You can have those one-player guilds winning #1 for just participating. I guess you can use that to figure which guilds are inactive by the number of players that are actively playing on a world.
• You still got to work on those rewards. You want people to participate fully and engage, you must give them much more than just "pocket change". There are other features in this game where a player gets much better rewards (and don't even think about nerfing them as many of us are smart enough to know how much was given for participating in the other features).
• Now, this one was a change. It's on par with GBG, which I do participate on my live world (on the main).

And now, for the "couldn't change" parts:

• I think when players stated "online" they mean "real" players that engage this feature. All I have seen are bots. I would like to challenge a real player, hence why I said that the matchup should be limited to neighborhoods (in my first posts when the first attempt came about with this feature) with the same cooldown parameters in preventing facing the same opponent repeatedly.
• I will have to agree with you there. I always like a surprise and challenge, hence why I sometimes attack my neighbors to see if I am going to bust through, go home limping, or wave the white flag.
• Probably you should since the PVP (as you stated) Arena is going to replace the neighborhood battles (no towers, and I will state it for that bit in a moment) that battles should not limit to what people worked hard for, this includes GBs invested and leveled. If you felt it was "unbalanced", you should not introduced them in the first place.
• Finally, many of us want the PVP towers to remain, not replaced. Some of the reasons within the last few bullet points have been already stated, but I will put forth some of my own (and it can be compared with others who feel the same about them):

• When attacking the neighborhood, GBG, and GE (I don't do GVG because someone forgot to put in the "trusted" bit so I am stuck; and why's that even required when a player can just go attack when it comes about to help the guild secure a territory), I would like to see how well I do with the rest of the neighborhood. It gives me that sense as I go up the ladder every week. It also shows me who is active in my neighborhood.​

• For lower ages, this would be a great source of acquiring medals (if they place well) which makes an incentive to attack the continent map as they are developing.​

• For those that utilize multiple units (of varying ages), this also shows them how well they are doing along with neighbors.​

• Gives them an incentive to attack neighbors and a bit of "shock and awe" when a person sees a neighbor at the top that they want to work hard in taking them down off that spot.​

​

With the introduction of the PVP Arena you compare yourself better to other players in one versus one battles directly, instead of indirectly by fighting via different gamefeatures which have different kind of battles.
With the Arena you are still able to compare yourself to other players in your guild, other players in your Era and with the global ranking. The Arena also gives a chance of a random reward when fighting, which the PVP Tower didn't.

• Wake me up when we have "other players" as in "real players" to actually face instead of the "bots" you guys got going. Might as well take neighborhoods off since we won't use this feature to gauge how well we do against them. Also, many of us never had a problem in fighting various battles to see how well we do (can't you see we rely on this) with our neighbors. To take this off, you're leaving us in the dark.
• The towers gave out medals (see my previous) for those who need them and don't have Arc or luck with incidents or events. I appreciate the rewards which probably will make me think in not attacking my neighbors and plundering them, which you probably will work on taking out next since with the towers gone, this feature made, and Galata Tower up, no one will have a reason to attack and plunder neighbors anymore. Hell, let's call it the Forge of Agriculture: the death of a once great game.

 

[Owl II]

There are some things we couldn't change, like:

- We cannot allow every GB to be applicable to the PVP Arena or this feature would become unbalanced

We listen to all of your feedback and forward it to our gamedevelopers. If you have suggestions, please share them with us, but be specific about it.

But it is not balanced. There is no balance between the attacking player's bonus and the defending player's bonus. There's no one I can't win. There's no one who can't win me. It's boring, regardless of the rewards. The result is always predictable.
Untie the attacker's and defender's bonuses from their stats in the city. How it is done in the settlement(Egypt) Give players another possibilyity to boost their attack and defense levels. It can be items(better items, not buildings), which we win for fighting here, in the arena. Everything will become more interesting

 

[Nessie]

the death of a once great game.

Right, there is no longer any real fun or challenge in the game, at least for endgamers. Until about Virtual Future the game is okay because it's basically what it used to be, more or less according to the original game ideas.

Now it lacks the intelligence and creativity with which the game developers presented this game on April 19, 2012. Instead, it's all about money, money, buying diamonds.

Why remove the towers? Why call it "PvP"? Got absolutely nothing to do with PvP.
This is a mockery of games that actually have PvP!

 

[DEADP00L]

I don't understand the use of bots to replace players in the last age, when it would have been enough to do as in GBG and give an additional attack and defense bonus to the defender.
This bonus could even increase with each new encounter between the same players.

 

[Julian24]

I know this is a lot, but please read. I think it explains a lot about the arena. I don't know if most players don't understand it or whatever, but what is missing from the PvP-Arena, that the PvP-Towers had?
The only thing I can imagine is, that you don't see on a weekly basis, who of your neighbors got the most battle points. I can see this a a valid point, but there are a lot of other things you can compare yourself to others.
Remember: You still get ranking points based on the battle points you receive after a fight. Only the neighborhood ranking and the rewards are gone. And what have we got as an exchange: A feature with multiple rankings, more fights you can do every day, way better rewards and finally a reason to improve your city defense.
The PvP-Arena is not the best feature to every exist and maybe will never be, but the things it improved from the PvP-Towers are very good and I can see it replacing the PvP-Towers on the live worlds.

And if you complain, that you can't defend in the arena: You can increase your own boosts, by building buildings, that improve your defense. But most will not do that, because "they are not good enough". So on the one hand you say you can't defend, but on the other side you don't want to change it. It seems, that rouges are not attacked first in the arena, so defending is very much possible.

And for those who complain, that it is not real PvP: The old towers were also called "PvP-Towers". Where is the PvP there? Where is the PvP in attacking a neighbor? Where is it in all other fights? I can tell you: Every time you are against another players army, you do a PvP fight. A player attacks another player. Just because the other player can't fight manually against you, does not mean it is not PvP. PvP is such a wide term. Everyone can define it differently. If inno defines it, like I explained, it is valid, if it is consistent. And it it.
Don't understand me wrong, I would also love to do a live battle against another player, but this is not innos PvP.

And lastly for those who complain, that inno does not listen to feedback: The "good feedback" (with this I mean the small amount of actual valid arguments and not the MANY comments like "GIVE US BACK PVP-TOWERS!!!!!!!!!!!!") was mainly:

1. Rewards are too bad
2. we miss the ranking against others
3. we want "real" PvP-fights
4. we want to fight manually
5. we want more attempts
6. we want better ways to defend
7. and the most important: Opponent-Ranking is broken, the enemies are way too strong

After inno took down the Arena again, after a lot of PLAYER-FEEDBACK, the did this:

1. They added more rewards, after battles and after climbing the leagues
2. They added age and guild rankings, so you can compete against your guild members, instead of neighborhood (for this I would wish an additional neighborhood ranking in the Arena)
3. explained above, why did probably did not do this
4. was added before
5. time for receiving an attempt was halfed, you can also now buy more with medals
6. (initially, buildings like ao, kraken and virgo do not count, to make it more difficult for the attacker), defending army does not focus rouges anymore
7. The matchmaking was edited, so this can't happen now

They changes a lot about it and we as community can feel proud, that inno listened to our good feedback and changed so much, that we have more fun playing it. But at the same time I really feel ashamed to be part of the beta community, that can't give normal feedback, spams the same things every day, generally does hate on features, before even really trying it out and giving it a chance. To all of these: Please, give the arena a chance, it is very good in it's current state. Inform yourself, before posting "hate comments". lay your negativity aside for a moment and look at it with a clean view and the post, what exactly the problems are. Hating does not bring us forward, but giving good and respectful feedback does. It does not have to be positive, you can complain about it, but give your reasons why and help everyone improving this feature and this game we all like to play.

Thanks for reading.

 

[Julian24]

And here is my feedback:
The PvP-Arena is now much better than before. Thank you for listening to us. There are just some things, I would like to be added/changes:

• Introduce a neighborhood ranking, just like the guild ranking
• change the league rewards depending on the age. The rewards there are good for a low age player, but saab players can't do anything with "one unit each" or "20 Forge Points". This should scale with the age to make the arena better for high age players.
• add an "attrition" for fighting the same player multiple times a week They should get a small boost every time they get attacked by the same player.
• also add this to bot, but to bots in general. Without this, players in saab with many ranking points will always get a bot, because nobody is this high yet. For some, the hard bot is still very easy to beat. Adding attrition every time you defeat a bot would stop that after a while.

 

[Fire Lord]

And here is my feedback:
The PvP-Arena is now much better than before. Thank you for listening to us. There are just some things, I would like to be added/changes:

• Introduce a neighborhood ranking, just like the guild ranking
• change the league rewards depending on the age. The rewards there are good for a low age player, but saab players can't do anything with "one unit each" or "20 Forge Points". This should scale with the age to make the arena better for high age players.
• add an "attrition" for fighting the same player multiple times a week They should get a small boost every time they get attacked by the same player.
• also add this to bot, but to bots in general. Without this, players in saab with many ranking points will always get a bot, because nobody is this high yet. For some, the hard bot is still very easy to beat. Adding attrition every time you defeat a bot would stop that after a while.

Last thing I want is attrition. It's been a challenge for me, I'm barely platinum.

 

[Fire Lord]

I will inform about this and let you know why it hasn't been distributed

Thanks so much.

 

[Julian24]

Last thing I want is attrition. It's been a challenge for me, I'm barely platinum.

It is just for fighting the same opponent over and over again. If you choose a different one or refresh, you will probably not even notice, if it increases for some enemies.

 

[Thunderdome]

I don't understand the use of bots to replace players in the last age, when it would have been enough to do as in GBG and give an additional attack and defense bonus to the defender.
This bonus could even increase with each new encounter between the same players.

We should do a poll of the players who played beta that are at a certain age. Not to be related to this feedback or feature, but to gather how many are actually playing this server at the age they are at.

Maybe I am missing something there.

Don't understand me wrong, I would also love to do a live battle against another player, but this is not innos PvP.

I guess I can call it Neighbor vs Neighbor (NvN) since it's one neighbor attacking the rest of his or her hood and another one is doing the same. I don't think Inno has placed any bots in the hood, but if they did, it could explain why some did not attack back. Of course, that could be a direct insult to a player who is just playing it "casually" and not wanting any part of fighting.

With that aside, I want to put forth some honorable mentions...

And here is my feedback:
The PvP-Arena is now much better than before. Thank you for listening to us. There are just some things, I would like to be added/changes:

• Introduce a neighborhood ranking, just like the guild ranking
• change the league rewards depending on the age. The rewards there are good for a low age player, but saab players can't do anything with "one unit each" or "20 Forge Points". This should scale with the age to make the arena better for high age players.
• add an "attrition" for fighting the same player multiple times a week They should get a small boost every time they get attacked by the same player.
• also add this to bot, but to bots in general. Without this, players in saab with many ranking points will always get a bot, because nobody is this high yet. For some, the hard bot is still very easy to beat. Adding attrition every time you defeat a bot would stop that after a while.

• I agree with you on this and would back this suggestion 1000% as I am sure every other player who uses the towers to see how well they do will agree to it. If Inno made this happen, that will take care of at least 60% of the concerns that are out there when deciding the tower's fate. At the end of the battle, it should show the ranking points (I am guessing just like the tower's ranking before it fully comes off) of the player along with where they rank with the neighborhood. The additional tab to check neighbor rankings would be an added touch to see how far up the ladder a player is with their hood. I don't check global ranking, guild ranking, or other rankings as sometimes the numbers can be "fluffed". I don't even check my global ranking as it is on the live server for the very same reason. It's a "meh" at that point.

• I am with you and I am going to wish us both "good luck" in getting Inno to at least get the scaling of rewards right. I am no fan of "chump change" and I would like to be rewarded for putting forth the hard work in getting so far. If the rewards are "dinky", it's a sure incentive to stop participating and do something else.

• I would love that. In one game I had played before, if a player loses a 1v1 battle during a battleground (typically a 15v15) event, that losing player gains some kind of boost that accumulates (as long as he/she was losing) until they are "strong" enough to win that battle with the player who they had lost to. In this arena, having such an "attrition" would make battling the same player challenging. The attrition should reset daily (just like GBG), else many will stop until it resets fully as it would be "too hard".

• Same to the bot as well.

 

[Fire Lord]

It is just for fighting the same opponent over and over again. If you choose a different one or refresh, you will probably not even notice, if it increases for some enemies.

I think I'm fighting the same people, but they are all people with PME and ME troops in the PE. They say PE, but they are PME troops. I can technically beat them, but it's a struggle. I can't go up against that and an added attrition. There is no attrition for neighborhoods, I don't feel like there should be for the PvP tower. I would suggest city shields work, but there is also nothing to plunder. I actually like the PvP tower, and once I get powerful, I will hopefully break into the top 500. I was more miffed that the Providences that had towers are now only coins and supplies, I was hoping for 2-5 goods of it's age. I do agree with the league rewards change, I would like to see that better implemented.

 

[OmegaLee]

V2 of the towers is better. I was overwhelmed by the amount of negative feedback on V1.

My #1 complaint about the first pass is fixed. The matchup system is a lot more reasonable.

I don't understand why the PVP towers need to come down. I recall a lot complaints round 1 about this. I'm seeing the it come back again this time.

 

[GateKeeper]

This Version 2 system is much better now, thanks for listening Inno and fixing the main issues. Plus we get personal rewards from individual battles. Sure they are rare, but at least they are better than Medals.

The only complaint we keep seeing, is PVP towers are gone. Why are the PVP towers needed though? To collect a few hundred Medals? Do you really need a pvp tower to show everyone in your hood you were active in GBG?

I saw a post earlier saying the PVP towers shouldn't include fights from Guild features like GE, GBG, GVG....totally agree with that, but honestly, the towers are pointless right now.

 

[Owl II]

And if you complain, that you can't defend in the arena: You can increase your own boosts, by building buildings, that improve your defense. But most will not do that, because "they are not good enough". So on the one hand you say you can't defend, but on the other side you don't want to change it. It seems, that rouges are not attacked first in the arena, so defending is very much possible.

Even if I have enough buildings( and enough FP to leveling GB), I don't have enough space in the city to build both attack and defense. Oh, i can replace the buildings an attack with thoset give defense. Then I can successfully defend against 90% of the players in the arena. That's cool. But what will happen to GE? with GBG? Yesterday I ended GBG with attrition of 121. How far will I go if I build the city's defenses? So don't say "you can" to me. I can. But it's not worth it. So play this PVP game. Win all the fights. Lose the entire defense. I'm not interested in this entertainment. There are others here

 

[Thunderdome]

Do you really need a pvp tower to show everyone in your hood you were active in GBG?

I think you just answered that one. The point of neighborhood battles is to see who does what and how far up the ladder they've gone. I don't look at the global ranking (points are just fluff; a person can get an Arc to 80 along with some choice GBs and will have more points to go in the rankings) and I don't compare with my guildmates (to each their own). I just concentrate on the neighborhood to see how far each of us has gone. Whether it was through GBG, GvG, GE, or even duking it out with each other, I look at that victory ranking screen and see where I am at and who is on with me.

The point of towers was for the lower aged folks (or folks that are starting out) to gather medals and compete with each other. Majority did not start with an Arc or have the grandest of luck with incidents or events that give them out. At least, for the first 1000, it was for me until I unlocked incidents and events and try my hand in seeing if I can get some to take it further. I won't build the Colosseum nor will I put down any Victory Towers (both are a waste of time and space).

Maybe if Inno gives out a level 80 Arc to every player, I may not have to wonder about the medals bit. However, the other aspect, the knowing was something I used to gauge my gaming performance. They could have just left it alone and introduce this as well. There's clearly nothing wrong in that.