Feedback Guild Expedition Update

[Kronan]

Guys, can you please remember that level 5 it supposed to be extremely.difficult and a common iron age player should never be able to complete that level?!

And can you please remember it must be difficult even for end game players to represent a real challenge?!

I am not saying that the stats of enemy armies or the amount of goods are ok but even nerfed, those numbers should still being high!

@Dessire - that's a B-school - failing grade idea. Exclude huge swaths of people and their money? Hmmmm. You don't build massively exclusionary products!!! That drives people away!

 

[-Alin-]

Personally, I touched the whole GE:V to record and help some friends make ideas about it, but I am dissapointed.

I will not touch again level 5, not need to do it, not even for those portraits.
That's it if we will no longer get 1st in the league, I don't care, our guild is level 100+ already.

 

[Beta567]

come on inno... it's your april's fool, right???

They got you, didn't they?

 

[UBERhelp1]

So, hot take, I actually really like this. GE 5 should be extremely difficult and costly for us now. Why? Several reasons:

1. Most don't have tons of defense boosts in their cities. This promotes more city diversity and opens up new avenues for defense boosts to actually be desirable.
2. Making GE 5 so hard means that it won't be a feature that gets added and is immediately forgotten. To complete it, you will have to work really hard, or build your city around completing it!
3. This helps balance the rewards and makes it so that, once again, you have to work hard to get them instead of just immediately getting tons of fragments and buildings as soon as GE 5 starts.

Don't you see? GE 5 finally gives this game potential to start moving away from buildings that give only attack boosts. It gives traders more of a reason to produce goods. It makes the game so much less linear and introduces more potential ways to build your city. In fact, I would go so far as to say we need more features like GE 5 introduced over time that take advantage of defense boosts and goods more than they do now. It's healthy for the game to have a feature that doesn't cater to the current meta.

Now, should the final boost for the army in SAJM be 2569%? Probably not. The values themselves will have to be tweaked, but not too far. I think ~1500% in same would be fair, and a lot less for lower ages. But for the first time in a while, I actually feel positive about this feature. Inno could release the next event with a building that gives defense boosts and no attack boosts, and guess what? It would actually be a viable option.

tl; dr, the first feature I've been wholeheartedly excited for in a while. Good job Inno. You did it.

 

[Mabusian der Graue]

You seriously haven't read the previous posts, have you? Which newbie can do GEV after 6 months? Come on! My beta city is a yaer old and I'm glad I can finally fight through lvl IV. estimates say you need anywhere between 8000 and 18,000 goods to negotiate through lvl V. WHICH newbiew has 8000 goods inventory from two ages every single week? you would need to stay in an era for 3 years to accumulate enough goods to play through this every week. Or have your CF leveled like 150.... again, which newbie will have the resources, fp etc. to do that? This simply means that people who have not played foe for at least 3-4-5 years will possibly have to wait YEARS to be able to do GEV. How is that fair, hm?

You didn't understand me. I said it takes six months for the top players to finish GE5 regularly without burning through their old pile of goods, 12 months for regular veterans and even longer, maybe two years for newbies. Newbies have the advantage that they can build their city knowing what will come. And I expect the next buildings to be even stronger than the current ones, with more goods and def bonuses.

 

[Emberguard]

I mean, what did everybody expect? That you simply rush through GE5?

I don't think anyone was expecting to rush through it, but the cost and difficulty level looks like it skipped Level 5 and went straight to Level 6.

I like that it's hard, but I think it needs to be somewhere inbetween what it is and what Level 4 is. Especially given we're getting fragment rewards and not full buildings.

 

[Raspa]

So, hot take, I actually really like this. GE 5 should be extremely difficult and costly for us now. Why? Several reasons:

1. Most don't have tons of defense boosts in their cities. This promotes more city diversity and opens up new avenues for defense boosts to actually be desirable.

it depends on the player's strategy here are my bonuses on Jaim's
here are my bonuses on Jaim's

 

[Mabusian der Graue]

I don't think anyone was expecting to rush through it, but the cost and difficulty level looks like it skipped Level 5 and went straight to Level 6.

I like that it's hard, but I think it needs to be somewhere inbetween what it is and what Level 4 is. Especially given we're getting fragment rewards and not full buildings.

I can agree with that. But I've heard some voices that want to change the whole system, especially away from the def boosts. And I think that isn't necessary. Tbh I don't think that GE5 goes live with these values.

 

[Dessire]

Inno, do you want to give more importance to defensive power + to players in a guild? then imagine this:

- A guild with 80 members

- The player with the lowest defense has 10% in both, defensive attack and defensive defense, the next one has 20%, the next one 25% . .. the member with the highest one has 1500% of defensive attack and 1000% of defensive defense. the previous one has 1200% and 844%.

- In GbG, diamond league,against that guild, when you are fighting to conquer one of that guild's sector, your attrition is increased every 2 fights, why every 2 fights? because the enemy guild has 80 members and in order to conquer 1 sector in diamond league you need 160 conquer points

- In the first 2 battles, your enemies, controled by the A.I. of the game, has 10% of attack and defense, battle 3 and 4 they have 20%, the 5 and 6 have 25% . . . the attrition 156 and 157 they have 1200% of attack and 844% of defense and attrition 158 and 159 enemies have 1500% of attack and 1000% of defense; so yes, the enemies you must defeat while fighting to conquer that sector owned by the guild in this example have the defensive attack and defense of all guild members.

- in a Guild with 40 members, the attrition is increased every 4 fights, against a guild of 2 members every 80 fights, and 1 guild well, the attrition is always the same but enemies have only one defense. in that case, if the 1 player guild has 4000% of defensive attack and defense, you can always do negotiations so against those guilds, negotiations should be better + remember that 1 guild player isn't a treat most of the time so have a little of difficult with that single player should not be a headache.

- If you are fighting against a weak guild with 30 members and you reach attrition 30, here 2 options: that attrition keeps being 30 if you fight another guild if you fight against another guild, your enemies will be the one corresponding to that attrition if that guild has 30 members or more. if have less members, should be the defensive attack and defense of the member with the highest number of defense. the second option is independant attritions. Against guild B you reach att 10. if you fight then aggainst guild C, your att should be 0.

- In order to not creat something like "2 guild decided to have all their members with 0% of defense and attack to have always an andless amount of fights", if guild A is being attacked and lose the sector, that guild loses 10% of the LP won until that moment. Example: if that guild has 90K LP and loses the sector, now the total should be 81K. if that guild generates 500 LP per hour, in 4 hours should have 83K LP, if that guild loses another sector, now it should have 74.7K of LP, allowing guilds who really want to play correctly have the chance of defeat guild A and guild B by just keeping enough sectors and allowing guild A and B exchange sectors every 4 hours. at the end of the 11 days, both top guilds now will be moved to platinum league only because they decided to not have good defenses.
In the case of weak guild in diamond league, imagine that the weakest have 10K LP, by losing 1 sector that guild will have 9000K. It is not like as if that guild have a chance to earn a better, excepting if that guild decides to, one night, netogiate a lot to conquer the whole map for example and make the other guilds lose 10% of what they have by each sector they had.

- Players of a guild can also earn an extra of 10 FP for each sector they own x hour and the total is delivered at the end of the 11 days in their inventory, but! that total is divided by the total amount of days they were not able to reach their max attrition. so if X guild had enough sectors to earn an extra reward of 3000 FPs for each member and a player never reached his/her max. att, he/she does not even did a single fight!., then the total he/she will receive should be 300 FPs. 300 FPs for free? yes! of course! is the guild leader(s) who is/are allowing that player still being a member insted of kick him/her for doing almos nothing!!! do not blame that player, blame the guild leader(s). the max. attrition considered by the game should be the max you can achieve in X season according to your battle power. if your guild is against 5 guilds and 4 of those guilds max. defensive power is 400% and guild 5 max. defensive power is 1500 and you have 800% of attack, then your max. att. is when you reach the attrition according to 800%, even if you never do fights against that guild. if in order to achieve 800% of attack against that guild you must reach att. 50, then attrition 50 is your top, does not matter if you do all your fights against other guilds, you must reach at least attrition 50, by negotiating or by doing fights.

more territories = more extra FPs, more time owning those territories, more FPs per hour and more defensive power, more time owning those territories.
..............

- Another option. When an enemy guild (guild B) is attacking one sector of your guild, the max. defensive attack and defense of the enemies who must defeat guild B should be: your guild member 1 defense + member 2 + member 3. . . .+ member 80 and divided by 10. If each member has an average of 500% of attack and defense as defensive power and your guild has 80 members, 500 x 80 = 40 000, divided by 10 = 4000. so at attrition 160, a player of guild B should fight against enemies with 4000% of attack and defense. with an increase of 25% for each attrition. (25% x 160 = 4000).

 

[-Alin-]

So, hot take, I actually really like this. GE 5 should be extremely difficult and costly for us now. Why? Several reasons:

1. Most don't have tons of defense boosts in their cities. This promotes more city diversity and opens up new avenues for defense boosts to actually be desirable.
2. Making GE 5 so hard means that it won't be a feature that gets added and is immediately forgotten. To complete it, you will have to work really hard, or build your city around completing it!
3. This helps balance the rewards and makes it so that, once again, you have to work hard to get them instead of just immediately getting tons of fragments and buildings as soon as GE 5 starts.

Don't you see? GE 5 finally gives this game potential to start moving away from buildings that give only attack boosts. It gives traders more of a reason to produce goods. It makes the game so much less linear and introduces more potential ways to build your city. In fact, I would go so far as to say we need more features like GE 5 introduced over time that take advantage of defense boosts and goods more than they do now. It's healthy for the game to have a feature that doesn't cater to the current meta.

Now, should the final boost for the army in SAJM be 2569%? Probably not. The values themselves will have to be tweaked, but not too far. I think ~1500% in same would be fair, and a lot less for lower ages. But for the first time in a while, I actually feel positive about this feature. Inno could release the next event with a building that gives defense boosts and no attack boosts, and guess what? It would actually be a viable option.

tl; dr, the first feature I've been wholeheartedly excited for in a while. Good job Inno. You did it.

To reduce them to like 1250/1250 last encounter.
And negotiations from 15 to 40 goods in the last encounters in SAJM.
Atm You will burn goods for nearly nothing with minimum 30 and maximum 90 for negotiations, lol.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

1250/1250 last encounter.
And negotiations from 15 to 40 goods in the last encounters in SAJM.
Atm You will burn goods for nearly nothing with minimum 30 and maximum 90 for negotiations, lol.

Thanks S/N for the info. Much appreciated! When you were working your way thru L5 did any of the chests contain an opportunity to win diamonds?

 

[-Alin-]

Thanks S/N for the info. Much appreciated! When you were working your way thru L5 did any of the chests contain an opportunity to win diamonds?

Zero diamonds, just a portrait and Fragments for each encounter.

 

[Kronan]

Thanks S/N for the info. Much appreciated! When you were working your way thru L5 did any of the chests contain an opportunity to win diamonds?

And also @-ScytheNinjAlin- please detail what, if anything, your Temple of Relics did for you in GE 5 - considering the investment you've made in that, as well.

 

[BabaORiley]

Is the concept for Lvl V inspired by the recent german ministry of economics:
minimal benefit at maximal costs?

 

[Shalimar the Brave]

I see the requirements for GE5 coming in concert with new event buildings with pretty insane stats. It seems Inno wants to make all our old city designs obsolete so that we are forced to spend diamonds to totally rework our cities. Pretty blatant money grab. I didn't mind spending a bit here and there to help support game development and get desirable event buildings, but the shift into a much more aggressive monetization of FoE has been a huge turnoff for me.

 

[Astrid]

It's just not worth going for it. It's not even motivating to make some changes to the city, add some tactician towers, some Appleton's cottages, remove some Winner's Plazas to make room for buildings with city defence... it's just not playable, but I was expecting this from them, to come up with some absurdity.

Anyways, my proposal to fix some of the issues that come with GE5 is to lower the enemies army bonuses by 60-70%.

 

[Beta567]

Reminds me of this type of mems:

 

[Kronan]

It's healthy for the game to have a feature that doesn't cater to the current meta.

Couldn't agree more - but NOT the way it was done. I wrote up what would have been a LOT more fun and much less invasive.

This current GE 5 bolt-on design is trying to FUSE a PROTON onto an ELECTRON - just not going to happen.

Or as they say in GHOSTBUSTERS - DO NOT CROSS THE STREAMS

But this could (as I suggested last week in the SPOILER'S topic).

What really should happen instead of a MIXED GE like this, is a better strategy idea. GE OFFENSE and GE Defense - 2 GE's (or maybe make that a goal).

You can play 1, either, or both each week, each 4 (or 5) levels.

1) If you play GE OFFENSE (classic GE), you get 4 levels or 5 levels of OFFENSE attack, as we have now
2) If you play GE DEFENSE, (elements of the proposed GE 5 we're about to see), you can play PURE DEFENSE, using city warriors. Inno would/could build a new warrior type for each era (1 more warrior to add to the 5 you already have), that specializing in city defense. This is NOT an attacking warrior, it's a strong defense warrior.

That would be so much fun. 2 types of GE that are parallel, but allow you to grow BOTH SIDES of your army, as part of your game!

 

[Devilsangel]

What they did for the army stats was take the gbg attrition stats. First couple of fight is the same consecutive attrition +1 than they started hopping. In colonial it was 19 attrition on 1 encounter to 78 attrition in 80 encounter. For SAJM its 106 last encounter attrition. So why the goods at 78 in last temple?
Have a feeling the hopping between attrition stats was done with their eyes closed. Just for the fun of it)

 

[CrashBoom]

it depends on the player's strategy here are my bonuses on Jaim's
here are my bonuses on Jaim's

View attachment 9134

here my bonus on live

gives enough good for negotating every week

I said it takes six months for the top players to finish GE5 regularly without burning through their old pile of goods,

true. I already can negotiate without burning my old pile of goods (on live)
i make each week enough for level 5. so only using goods of the last 7 days




as you can calculate (that age is running less than 1 year on live)
makes over 4k per week for the upper 4 and 7k of the one I produce in the colony


so that top player can finish it already every week when it goes live
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