Discussion Guild Battlegrounds Watchtower and Siege Camp Ability Re-balance

[Yekk]

In my opinion, it's pointless to conjure a new poll each time a season has closed in GBg; it's not going to change people's minds on the subject. The initial feedback to this very change should have been considered (talking about from all sides and all players that took the time in posting). Two season's worth of feedback (if not the one season for the two weeks) should have been sufficient enough for Inno to make their changes or to revert back to the old way and try something else (like doing their job in banning cheats and botters).

Just say, "despite your feedback, this change is going to stay and will go to the live servers" just to save us from wasting our words further into this travesty. Not making any promises, but I am pretty sure those who already had made their predictions known will probably see those come to fruition in the weeks ahead. It'll be like the so-called PVP (I call it PVR or PVB) Arena when it first came out, had gotten weeks of disapproval, went to the EN server for a further test (because the beta community on which this was tested on wasn't enough for keeping an influence), had gotten more disapproval, was put on the shelf for months, and then finally re-introduced. I don't know if anyone uses it these days but to me, it's extra fights/resources for quests/tasks. However, I was really glad you kept the towers, battle points from battles, and rewards from towers (for the players that need them; i.e., small players) in tact, whereas they were to be removed upon the introduction of such that caused an uproar.

No, had Inno been much detailed than their standard cut and paste script as to the reasons why this change was to be warranted, the players would have understood and probably work together to come up with a better change that would benefit everyone as a whole (and not just a select few or league group). So far, six of us, and possibly more, had come up with ways on how to revamp the current GBg. Heck, we (the players) should be the developing team since we do play our game and often discuss on how things go from our end and compare notes with one another to find some sort of common ground to build upon.

Nothing against you, moderator, as you're the liaison. But you can pass the message along, I am sure of it.

Given time Inno hopes they win a poll. This new attempt was unwise. Like asking a marathon runner 100 meters in to a race " How is it going? tired yet". It serves no purpose. Over 2100 posts here of which many have shown Inno's its faults with GBG past and present. Enough a Version 2 should be done. There was a time when developers were more versed with games but now many gamers have played for decades. Understand both game play and how it should make money for the games owners. Ignoring those players is wrong.

 

[CrashBoom]

Our map looks about the same. There are 3 guilds of 70+ members in a group. 10 players have 0 fights at the moment. Another 10 have done less than 50 fights

but your opponents would have more sectors without the cap ?

 

[Publius Cornelius Scipio]

GBG became stupid. Nothing more to say.
INNO insist to go on the same way, so I have to thank them for killing the only interesting thing in the game.
All the discussions are bla-bla and don`t have any effect, Even if 100% will be against the changes, INNO will continue with this non-sense.

 

[Owl II]

but your opponents would have more sectors without the cap ?

Really? So why don't they use it? I know what could cure it. Perhaps Inno should have made the camps nerfed for us and left it as it is for them. No, Inno should have added 2 more free camps to their headquarters. Aw! No, I know for sure! We should go and get those sektors for them!

Beta is just sleepy. But two strong guilds in the living worlds will swap as before. It will just be more boring

 

[Emberguard]

I do not know what you are talking about. I wrote about tactical tasks to control this part of the gameplay. Make a schedule, gather players to attack. make a decision, close the province, or no. Coordinate with partners if there are partners in the group. Such things are performed by a group of leaders. They could be involved easily in the process of capturing provinces themselves before Nerf. But I can't imagine how it will work now. One of our beta leaders did over 400 negotiations last season. I understand well where this figure came from. Probably not because he likes negotiations.

Ok, back to what I was responding to:

Many leaders will not babysit a map if they are out of attrition early in the AM

They won't want to, but they will have to. Otherwise, what kind of leaders are they?

My point is babysitting isn’t leading. It’s trying to do everything yourself as if you’re playing solo. That defeats the purpose of even having a Guild in the first place.

That part I bolded has zero reason to require a leader to be present if your Guild has been taught how you as the leader would want things done. It only requires a leader present if everyone else is incapable of decision making, which is usually a reflection on whether they have been given permission to do so.

Also babysitting by leaders usually creates a dependency on being babysat. If people know they all need to check the maps they’re far more likely to do it than if a leader makes it their sole responsibility

 

[-Alin-]

Is everyone in your guild "that normally fights" still able to get their full attrition every day or not so much?

40 out of 55 members have at least 10 fights did this round.
the top 20 of them are doing their full attrition on map everywhere they find judging by their numbers, stats and era they are in.

Spoiler

map in this morning, and my attrition waiting.

 

[King Flush]

honestly I've lost all interest in the game, hardly played this last week, just the thought that this might actually come in has made me question a lot, I'm not going to invest any more serious time in the game until I know the outcome of this, I don't think there's many in my guild that are really aware of the impending nerf, I've only spoke about it with a few but maybe like an infection, the lack of effort and participation has seemed to have spread through the guild, with a definitite feeling of a lack of enthusiasm, maybe it's just coincidental and people are holidaying or enjoying the sunshine, time will tell. If it wasn't for the fact I don't want to go against my fellow 'against' voters I'd be temmpted to just change my vote now, as beginning to think the option of seeing the game go down the pan is preferable than my continued participation, I probably won't lobby any further against the changes as whilst I continue to think it's terrible for the game, let me watch it burn to the ground that is now my desire, will just sit back and see what happens and assess whether to continue or not but maybe I'm done with the game now regardless of the outcome.

have fun y'all

 

[CrashBoom]

just wondering:
if somebody would treat everybody unfair doesn't that make it fair

 

[Owl II]

Ok, back to what I was responding to:



My point is babysitting isn’t leading. It’s trying to do everything yourself as if you’re playing solo. That defeats the purpose of even having a Guild in the first place.

That part I bolded has zero reason to require a leader to be present if your Guild has been taught how you as the leader would want things done. It only requires a leader present if everyone else is incapable of decision making, which is usually a reflection on whether they have been given permission to do so.

Also babysitting by leaders usually creates a dependency on being babysat. If people know they all need to check the maps they’re far more likely to do it than if a leader makes it their sole responsibility

This is not babysitting. This is process management. But we see a great example of the game "without a babysitter" where there is no clear plan. These guilds either beat the coast randomly, or frolic in platinum. And then they go to the forum to cry, so that the developers removed from the game of the "kindergarten with a babysit". We have a saying: "Seven nannies have a child without an eye." That's how guilds usually play "without a babysit"

 

[kawada]

I feel like we need to advertise the second round of voting in our guilds and even in this thread. Since we cannot post comments in the new thread, it’s quite invisible behind the other forum topics with new posts.

https://forum.beta.forgeofempires.com/index.php?threads/guild-battlegrounds-watchtower-and-siege-camp-ability-re-balance.15678/

 

[CrashBoom]

I feel like we need to advertise the second round of voting in our guilds and even in this thread. Since we cannot post comments in the new thread, it’s quite invisible behind the other forum topics with new posts.

https://forum.beta.forgeofempires.com/index.php?threads/guild-battlegrounds-watchtower-and-siege-camp-ability-re-balance.15678/

isn't that manipulating the vote
you are only avertising it to your guild where more people are against it than in the average guild

that's like a vote: what is the favorite soccer team
and you only inform everybody in Madrid to vote

but that it is "invisible" actually gives everybody the same chance to find it

 

[kawada]

isn't that manipulating the vote

you are only avertising it to your guild where more people are against it than in the average guild

I didn’t say to advertise in MY guild only. It’s a suggestion for everyone in this discussion
People in this thread have different opinions as well as their guilds or particular guild members. If all those people vote, it will be quite a representative result.
also, I’ve posted it in an multi guild thread I participate and in the global chat.
how it’s a manipulating? Those are just measures to increase awareness

 

[Amdira]

Maybe it's just time for Inno to advertise this new thread as they did with this one

 

[Emberguard]

I’ve posted it in an multi guild thread I participate and in the global chat.
how it’s a manipulating?

Your network of players wouldn't encompass all players, neither would it be a random selection out of everyone. So in that sense it'd be manipulating (obviously unintentional on your part for it to be manipulation of votes)

I do like your idea of bumping the thread so everyone can see it though

 

[CrashBoom]

neither would it be a random selection out of everyone

but there you don't know the result

Your network of players wouldn't encompass all players

but there the result will be: majority no

So in that sense it'd be manipulating (obviously unintentional

intenional because his goal is to increase the no-votes


like i said:
a vote for the favorite soccer team and I would tell a spanish guild to vote.
then the majority will pick a spanish team and not an english, italian or german

I do like your idea of bumping the thread so everyone can see it though

actually it would be better to get the players to vote which haven't been here yet and didn't vote before

there you get a more unbiased result

 

[CrashBoom]

can't Inno just do a forced ingame vote

everybody must vote after login to be able to play (that would be really representative)

- yes
- no
- I don't want to do this stupid vote. just let me play (that would be the current 3rd option: can't decide)

 

[jovada]

GBG became stupid. Nothing more to say.
INNO insist to go on the same way, so I have to thank them for killing the only interesting thing in the game.
All the discussions are bla-bla and don`t have any effect, Even if 100% will be against the changes, INNO will continue with this non-sense

Inno is still a city-building game and GbG is a part of it. If it is the only interesting thing of the game maybe you better move to a wargame.

 

[kawada]

Inno is still a city-building game and GbG is a part of it. If it is the only interesting thing of the game maybe you better move to a wargame.

Interesting logic… we don’t force Inno to release any new features which are not aligned with the whole game style, we just ask to not ruin what they already have

 

[Beta King]

Alright the results are in today i have disconnected around 40% of my city and it left me with 995%/900% for my run which in SAM with all Sents to 70 then 2/8 sents & rogues holding back sents(semi auto) and selecting single wave fights i was able to run my attrition up to 81. So the outcomes are quite interesting with full power 2015/1005 atr to 102, 1500/950 atr to 90, and 995/900 atr to 81. Meaning around 40% of my city can be crashed and i will only loose 21 attrition. How many FPs would be averaged on 63 fights i'm wondering?

 

[DEADP00L]

on average over 63 fights, you will lose 126 FP.

126 FP x 12 days of GbG / 14 days = 108 daily FP