Discussion The future for FoE ?

[xivarmy]

While this can be understood if on a home network or close shared connection, the bigger question is how Inno would differentiate on players that might be on larger single IP provisioned connections like hotels, internet cafes, and the like? The guild I joined in beta have some people residing in neighboring states and/or cities close to me. While I do not know where they live, work, or go for social, what would be the chances of Inno detecting I would be on a shared connection versus I would be on a single connection? Possibly disabling my (or their) ability to donate to their GBs (or mine) for the duration until I get out of range? The only way I can think of is being on my own connection (mobile data) and not going on to wi-fi at hotels, eating spots, malls, etc. if I don't want to worry on it; but that will defeat the purpose of going on wi-fi if on a limited plan.

It's not til you're out of range - the restriction lasts weeks at least if it comes up and links the two accounts. But I haven't heard of any false-positives. It's usually couples that get the restriction.

Note that different machines on the same IP can be distinguished (they'll route back through the same IP, but they have the information necessary to keep on going to your device, not to every device sharing that connection (typically I think different ports will map to different devices is how shared IPs work).

 

[Thunderdome]

Note that different machines on the same IP can be distinguished (they'll route back through the same IP, but they have the information necessary to keep on going to your device, not to every device sharing that connection (typically I think different ports will map to different devices is how shared IPs work).

I had been at sites that utilize a provisional IP address (usually given by the telco/internet provider) which is just the one. Most IP tracking is done via that. It ignores the internal IP addresses that may be given when connecting to a switch or a router (if it has built-in wi-fi and LAN connections). You connect to a network and you're given an IP address of mmm.mmm.mmm.101; the provisional address will be ppp.ppp.ppp.54. The IP tracker will only track ppp.ppp.ppp.54. Another user will connect to the same network and will be given an IP of mmm.mmm.mmm.102. The IP tracker will still track their address to ppp.ppp.ppp.54.

Now, if you remained on this network, say Starbucks, and the other user connects through a hotel (which can be a different network; can be ddd.ddd.ddd.31 as the provider IP), the IP tracker will track two different IPs this time; even if both users have the same internal IP address of mmm.mmm.mmm.101 (as this can be familiar with the 192.168 factory default networks).

But, if Inno tracks via a supplemented method (like MAC address, device information, O/S environment, browser/app version and ID, etc.), it could put their's and everyone else's minds at ease.

Myself, I had to secure Inno's permission in the event I have others that are going to play on my guest network to let them know. As they knew I had always played fair, I just didn't want to wake up with an alert to my account because I play mostly on the browser with my Entertainment Work Console (EWC) and sometimes on the tablet (with the app) or sometimes in the car when I am at a stop and not doing work or home maintenance related tasks.

It's a blessing and a curse to be so knowledgeable in the world of technology and internet-connectivity; since I am working on my way towards Fiber Optics and Cellular provisioning; a very big field to be in these days.

 

[Amdira]

At least for beta - if I'm informed correctly, inactive accounts are being deleted after 6 months - thus a permanent ban should automatically lead to account deleting after 6 months - or have I overseen something?

 

[-Alin-]

This game reached it's peak few years ago, what future do You still want from it?

 

[Thunderdome]

At least for beta - if I'm informed correctly, inactive accounts are being deleted after 6 months - thus a permanent ban should automatically lead to account deleting after 6 months - or have I overseen something?

That had been true. When I returned to beta after taking a long hiatus due to real life commitments (work being the top one), the city I had built (and the account) was deleted (hiatus was like 4-5 years, lol). Luckily, I was able to recreate the account and get a fresh start (city-wise) on it; it happened while the Forge Bowl event was running.

However, when I logged into an account nearly forgotten in the US server, the account remain (I've deleted a few worlds off it) and I can play from where I left off.

A person creates an account. That player uses 3rd party software to advance. That player was reported. Inno takes appropriate measures in banning the account (how do they do for circumventions, I wonder). Said player is out for the count. However, if Inno had that time limit, the account would be deleted after said time, and I am going to assume the ban as well. A week later after that time, player recreates the account and is back to doing the same thing that got them banned in the first place. Other players are disappointed as a result and felt that Inno had done little.

The above may be true or not, but I was using such as an example to compare two servers when it comes to inactivity and/or account deletion practices as well simulate a banning situation and what possible loopholes a player can exploit.

 

[Townjest]

This game reached it's peak few years ago, what future do You still want from it?

A Future for Honest Fairplaying players where we can enjoy FoE with out cheaters

 

[-Alin-]

A Future for Honest Fairplaying players where we can enjoy FoE with out cheaters

I tried, killed 2 year of my life with my guildmates to play against a bunch of cheaters and macro/script siegers, we shared things, softwares to support, even tried to be in touch with Zarok Dai at that time 2017-19, all without luck, we quit GvG and ghosted them to burn goods and units in different eras, but this began boring too after few months.
Recently I have seen InnoGames have taken measures against alts and pushing accounts of those guild players, but it's too late, removing some great buildings levels and banning some accounts will not stop them from setting macroses with delay of 1-3 miliseconds, also having cheating players with below 40 miliseconds(computer-innogames servers) will make them umbeatable in laying sieges.

Spoiler: mine

still stand no chance against them

The fun of playing GvG gone long ago, and Guess what InnoGames did to fix this, few minor changes which were worse and have been reverted, and after they added GbG which will NEVER take place of GvG and it has ZERO strategy, even a child who learnt to play chess will be able to arrange swaps and think sectors for their gain )
FoE it's a clicker game today, it lost his strategy based mechanic long ago.
Now all You need are goods for arc, struggle a bit to gather fps till level 80, and voila, monkey see monkey do, gather attack, raise buildings, game is ultra ultra easy.

Before they learnt how to use macros and scripts, we succeded in beating 3 guilds at a time+ some smaller ones and reach first position for one day as DragonStar, that was the best and fun day that we had on the laggish version of flash player, we were the reason why they began using macros )
People older here know about which guild/s I am talking about.
I will not post names either, it will be a bad example from me calling them out.

 

[Thunderdome]

And I thought my experience with cheaters was really bad.

I remembered our alliance in a different game had it difficult with the enemy alliance that they had two corps (er, guilds) full with alts, low leveled of course. Thanks to flagship design, a fleet can arrive in seconds to attack. All an alt needed was at least 4-5 1-star commanders at level 50 that can take a full 9 slot fleet setup of 3000 ships each (8 of those slots filled with regular ships while 1 filled with the flagship). They would warp next to us as we are ready to attack one of theirs and they would send their fleets to our planets, sometimes tying up our fleets from being sent to the planet we're attacking for a global PVP based intergalactic war. They didn't care if they lost their entire lot, but it held us from attacking (those of us that had built ships and trained our special commanders to 9-star level 50s). We had reported that to the host and developers but nothing was done. Many players had quit as a result of it, myself included. Years later, I heard the game is no more.

 

[Townjest]

I tried, killed 2 year of my life with my guildmates to play against a bunch of cheaters and macro/script siegers, we shared things, softwares to support, even tried to be in touch with Zarok Dai at that time 2017-19, all without luck, we quit GvG and ghosted them to burn goods and units in different eras, but this began boring too after few months.
Recently I have seen InnoGames have taken measures against alts and pushing accounts of those guild players, but it's too late, removing some great buildings levels and banning some accounts will not stop them from setting macroses with delay of 1-3 miliseconds, also having cheating players with below 40 miliseconds(computer-innogames servers) will make them umbeatable in laying sieges.

Spoiler: mine

still stand no chance against them View attachment 8072

The fun of playing GvG gone long ago, and Guess what InnoGames did to fix this, few minor changes which were worse and have been reverted, and after they added GbG which will NEVER take place of GvG and it has ZERO strategy, even a child who learnt to play chess will be able to arrange swaps and think sectors for their gain )
FoE it's a clicker game today, it lost his strategy based mechanic long ago.
Now all You need are goods for arc, struggle a bit to gather fps till level 80, and voila, monkey see monkey do, gather attack, raise buildings, game is ultra ultra easy.

Before they learnt how to use macros and scripts, we succeded in beating 3 guilds at a time+ some smaller ones and reach first position for one day as DragonStar, that was the best and fun day that we had on the laggish version of flash player, we were the reason why they began using macros )
People older here know about which guild/s I am talking about.
I will not post names either, it will be a bad example from me calling them out.

That is exactly my point !!!! We need to stop cheaters and they should be banned harder and permanently !!!!!

And yes, we all know which Guild you are talking about.. And its so frustrated that they keep on playing !!
And then one player got his Arc taken down a bit... What a joke !!!! Kick the player instantly, he is ruining the game !!!
And WHY keep one player, who is ruining the game for a lot of players ???

And thats is also excactly why players has lost confidence on Inno doing something !!!

 

[Tanmay11]

I tried, killed 2 year of my life with my guildmates to play against a bunch of cheaters and macro/script siegers, we shared things, softwares to support, even tried to be in touch with Zarok Dai at that time 2017-19, all without luck, we quit GvG and ghosted them to burn goods and units in different eras, but this began boring too after few months.
Recently I have seen InnoGames have taken measures against alts and pushing accounts of those guild players, but it's too late, removing some great buildings levels and banning some accounts will not stop them from setting macroses with delay of 1-3 miliseconds, also having cheating players with below 40 miliseconds(computer-innogames servers) will make them umbeatable in laying sieges.

Spoiler: mine

still stand no chance against them View attachment 8072

The fun of playing GvG gone long ago, and Guess what InnoGames did to fix this, few minor changes which were worse and have been reverted, and after they added GbG which will NEVER take place of GvG and it has ZERO strategy, even a child who learnt to play chess will be able to arrange swaps and think sectors for their gain )
FoE it's a clicker game today, it lost his strategy based mechanic long ago.
Now all You need are goods for arc, struggle a bit to gather fps till level 80, and voila, monkey see monkey do, gather attack, raise buildings, game is ultra ultra easy.

Before they learnt how to use macros and scripts, we succeded in beating 3 guilds at a time+ some smaller ones and reach first position for one day as DragonStar, that was the best and fun day that we had on the laggish version of flash player, we were the reason why they began using macros )
People older here know about which guild/s I am talking about.
I will not post names either, it will be a bad example from me calling them out.

Inno dont care. its as simple as that, despite there being evidence of massive cheating(GB pushing and Scripts) all they did was take 40 levels of someone's gb, its a big joke..when you can clearly see way more levels done using these push accounts.

worse these 9~ accounts that were banned are back again.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

Inno dont care. its as simple as that, despite there being evidence of massive cheating(GB pushing and Scripts) all they did was take 40 levels of someone's gb, its a big joke..when you can clearly see way more levels done using these push accounts.

worse these 9~ accounts that were banned are back again.

How can you identify push accounts? In my main city I have 75 guildmates and 140 friends, all of which are potential partners in GB swaps with me. It seems to me that, unless you examine all contributions to all GBs, it's just not possible to conclude that any pushing of FPs is happening. Also, if I want to donate FPs to another player without expectation of a return on my investment it's not against the rules so how would you differentiate that from pushing? My point is that where you see pushing it may just as well be honest activity.

 

[-Alin-]

How can you identify push accounts? In my main city I have 75 guildmates and 140 friends, all of which are potential partners in GB swaps with me. It seems to me that, unless you examine all contributions to all GBs, it's just not possible to conclude that any pushing of FPs is happening. Also, if I want to donate FPs to another player without expectation of a return on my investment it's not against the rules so how would you differentiate that from pushing? My point is that where you see pushing it may just as well be honest activity.

Scoredb and screenshots, bigger accounts had levels removed from gbs, which will reduce ranking points and we were looking st the graphics, also we had a list made long ago with our "targets" from "enemy" guild )
So we made ss's before and after, later searched for activity of those accounts, great building levels, accounts that were in those great buildings and so on, or gbs removed, and some of them(If not all) are back online now.
We knew with few years before, but they used VPNs to hide the "activity" of those Accounts, but this week they were caught and banned )

Regarding pushing, in this case was evident, here on beta, but took too long for FoE to make actions.
Not sure how are things on any other servers.

 

[Thunderdome]

Hence why I don't buy into any developer's or host's diatribe when they say they could not discuss measures that were taken against players that violate the ToS by cheating. For us, why do we care on how the player felt when they get banned? They should not have cheated in the first place if they don't want to be in everyone's eyes to be heard about.

On every other place like chat, social media, and the like, a ban is permanent when it comes to that. If said person worked that hard in getting their stuff up to where they are happy with it, they will lose all that when the account is permanently banned. In my days of IRC, I seen a lot of folks banned for violations of the ToS when they were trolling others. The host in a chatroom would tell us that user xxxx is banned because of *offense*. Those who were harassed by said individual were relieved to know they won't hear from them ever again. Of course, there are those that would circumvent a ban by creating a new account, but that's when IP associations came into play in banning IP as well so they won't circumvent such.

For one to say they cannot discuss such matters, it's not good enough, especially when entire masses of players are affected. The players want to know that this cheat has been banned permanently without any possible way of retrieving the former glory of their account.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

Scoredb and screenshots, bigger accounts had levels removed from gbs, which will reduce ranking points and we were looking st the graphics, also we had a list made long ago with our "targets" from "enemy" guild )
So we made ss's before and after, later searched for activity of those accounts, great building levels, accounts that were in those great buildings and so on, or gbs removed, and some of them(If not all) are back online now.
We knew with few years before, but they used VPNs to hide the "activity" of those Accounts, but this week they were caught and banned )

Regarding pushing, in this case was evident, here on beta, but took too long for FoE to make actions.
Not sure how are things on any other servers.

Thanks. Part of your reply indicates that INNO has taken action against cheaters. Good to know.

 

[Pericles the Lion]

For one to say they cannot discuss such matters, it's not good enough, especially when entire masses of players are affected. The players want to know that this cheat has been banned permanently without any possible way of retrieving the former glory of their account.

INNO makes the rules not the players and they said that they will not provide details about punishments meted out. While you may think that this is not "good enough" it is what it is. I've said this before but it bears repeating....I am part of the player "silent majority" that really doesn't care much about potential cheating in the game because I have not seen where it has any impact on my game. I get it that potential cheating offends you but, if you've been fighting it for years I have to ask why? If I were in your position I would have found greener pastures long ago. Life is too short.

 

[Thunderdome]

In this game, I haven't been in a position where cheating is affecting me, presently, but I do read about it on global sometimes like it was a tele-novela (Spanish soap opera); and that often raises questions and/or concerns. If a guild or several guilds are having a problem with just that one guild, then it is a problem for everyone else that might face that guild one day in their lives.

A lot of folks I had known in the past, had quit because of cheats. This is across many games I had played, some of which were best players to ask for help or for items to be traded. So, basically, when a person chooses to cheat, it affects everyone else one way or another.

 

[Balinor]

In this game, I haven't been in a position where cheating is affecting me, presently,

I doubt it ever will I have been playing FoE for 10 years and the so called "cheaters" dont affect my game at least not negatively
I make more FPs , more free diamonds ,more battles ,more trades, more of everything than in the past
But you keep listening to other players and having those FEELINGS that others are affected by the cheaters


All you guys crying about cheaters are only being cheated out of bragging rights

 

[Tanmay11]

How can you identify push accounts? In my main city I have 75 guildmates and 140 friends, all of which are potential partners in GB swaps with me. It seems to me that, unless you examine all contributions to all GBs, it's just not possible to conclude that any pushing of FPs is happening. Also, if I want to donate FPs to another player without expectation of a return on my investment it's not against the rules so how would you differentiate that from pushing? My point is that where you see pushing it may just as well be honest activity.

because a player had 40 levels taken off their gb, and the accounts that donated to that gb were banned. but these accounts are back again....

 

[Thunderdome]

I doubt it ever will I have been playing FoE for 10 years and the so called "cheaters" dont affect my game at least not negatively

It's good that you played 10 years, mate. I had played on and off within that time due to RL commitments where I was really married to the job I enjoyed doing. It may not affect me right this minute, but that doesn't mean I would condone such, especially with the friendships and relationships I had forged over the years throughout.

I make more FPs , more free diamonds ,more battles ,more trades, more of everything than in the past

So do I. Whether it was through MooingCat's guides, FoE Hints on YT, or some Wiki research, I tend to find ways to make my game play more enjoyable than the day before. I am still learning new things when I am with others in a guild that I didn't know previously. Some of the knowledge I gained in Beta, I take to the live server worlds, including what to expect, in terms of quest list, so I can better maximize my experience instead of being that person who is struggling... because we all had been there before, one way or another.

But you keep listening to other players and having those FEELINGS that others are affected by the cheaters

I only make my own inferences. However, if a friend of mine is having a problem with a cheat, then I am having a problem.

All you guys crying about cheaters are only being cheated out of bragging rights

This is a typical sentence that was said at least once through my gaming life. As I say, you either condone the actions of such or are doing it yourself (I won't accuse of the latter, though). Is it wrong to want a fair playing environment? People who bot are just trash players in my opinion. Real players do not bot.

because a player had 40 levels taken off their gb, and the accounts that donated to that gb were banned. but these accounts are back again....

Ow. Now, that's just a slap on the face.

 

[Amdira]

Am I affected by cheating directly? No. I'm not interested in ranking points, but many are and i think this is a point that has to be considered. New players will have a look at the top players and guilds to learn how to be "sucessfull" in this game. The top players and guilds should show by example how to play this game in a fair way to have both fun and success. Unfortunately on all worlds I'm playing there are rumours or even proof for cheating and pushing, which makes trying to win with fairplay just frustrating. If seemingly nothing happens from Inno's side some might think it's not forbidden, but just tolerated and maybe some more will start cheating in the one or other way or just give up fighting for fair play. that can't be the solution.
I'm aware you cannot erase cheating completely from any game or even in RL, but when it is being detected and punished by a short ban and then they just come back and go on with it - that's more than frustrating for every fair playing person. I've always been an observer and what I'm watching actually doesn't make be believe in justice any more.