Feedback Forge Bowl 2019 - Balancing Changes

[DeletedUser9608]

Is it intended for Silver and Gold league awards to each now have two Colossus upgrades?

 

[Feanor II]

Whales will whale anyways if the building's good enough (see cities with 60+ ships or 20+ cherry sets (~600k diamonds worth)). People who might buy a 2nd or 3rd if it were cheaper might not buy any. From a $ earned perspective you have to look at whether the increased earnings from those who will spend as much as they have to to get what they want outweighs the lost earnings from those who won't spend at all because it's too much to get anything. If this building is a new tier of power upgrade effectively (and at 14% attack boost with 6 FP in VF I'd say it is), they're charging for the whales. There might be slightly watered down versions for cheaper a few events down the road.

IDK if I count as a whale when using those numbers; between my 2 "main" worlds I have 23 Pirate Ships and 12 fully-leveled Cherry Sets. Maybe I'm a mini-whale...

The problem with those comparisons is that during the Summer Event it was significantly cheaper to acquire a Level 7 Ship than it will be to acquire a Level 10 Colossus. In addition, even though the Ship Upgrades were not on the wheel, there were Sunken Treasures you could get along the way that were an efficiency upgrade* over existing options. The Cherry Set is an even further-off comparison since the pieces themselves were Daily Specials that could be acquired directly. With the Colossus/Forge Bowl Event, there is no prize that improves efficiency available, and the overall cost is significantly higher. Inno seems to be saying I need to buy hundreds of dollars worth of detritus to get the additional L10 Colossus. So I think after this event, between my 2 "main" worlds I'll have 23 Pirate Ships, 12 fully-leveled Cherry Sets, and two L10 Colossuses (or whatever the plural of "Colossus" is...Colossi?)

*-this is the point I don't think IG is quite comprehending. Their "whales" (to use your term) are typically end-stage players who don't need anymore buildings to collect dust in inventory. What matters is efficiency. Offering new buildings that are no improvement over the existing ones is not an incentive to buy. Upgrades/better options are what will sell.

 

[xivarmy]

IDK if I count as a whale when using those numbers; between my 2 "main" worlds I have 23 Pirate Ships and 12 fully-leveled Cherry Sets. Maybe I'm a mini-whale...

Mid-sized I'd say. That's no small amount of whaling but there's certainly much bigger ones in the sea.

The problem with those comparisons is that during the Summer Event it was significantly cheaper to acquire a Level 7 Ship than it will be to acquire a Level 10 Colossus.

It certainly was - the level 10 colossus is also flat-out better (slightly less space at 18 squares including half road vs 22.5 squares, and has the FP of the royal ship with attack higher than the pirate ship). They run events at a wide variety of price-points though. When the grand prize is something people are legit excited about being better than existing options it tends to be very expensive to get much extra.

In addition, even though the Ship Upgrades were not on the wheel, there were Sunken Treasures you could get along the way that were an efficiency upgrade* over existing options.

I didn't see many whales running Sunken Treasures though. Mostly those appealed to low spenders that have to work for every inch and need some sort of production building to run their daily challenges. The shipyard cities don't tend to have any.

The Cherry Set is an even further-off comparison since the pieces themselves were Daily Specials that could be acquired directly.

It still pretty much came down to a flat diamond cost per set you wanted (and for level 2 sets that was close to 20k at about 2k diamonds per kit) - and you weren't getting much else of value because those were the specials you were chasing and the other chest contents were just filler. Granted you could decide you didn't care about certain level 2s as well as overlap certain pieces and save some of those kits.

With the Colossus/Forge Bowl Event, there is no prize that improves efficiency available, and the overall cost is significantly higher. Inno seems to be saying I need to buy hundreds of dollars worth of detritus to get the additional L10 Colossus. So I think after this event, between my 2 "main" worlds I'll have 23 Pirate Ships, 12 fully-leveled Cherry Sets, and two L10 Colossuses (or whatever the plural of "Colossus" is...Colossi?)

At better than a ship I'm sure we'll see some people break out the credit card. I'm not one of them, nor will I be diamond mining 35k for an extra colossus on any world. I however cannot deny that there are people in the game that will chase a building this good.

*-this is the point I don't think IG is quite comprehending. Their "whales" (to use your term) are typically end-stage players who don't need anymore buildings to collect dust in inventory. What matters is efficiency. Offering new buildings that are no improvement over the existing ones is not an incentive to buy. Upgrades/better options are what will sell.

They target different events at different markets. This one may be for the biggest whales who have more dollars than sense. Another might come along with slightly worse prizes that will be of no interest to people with cities full of the best ones but that offers more/$ instead of more/space and smaller spenders might jump at that one instead.

 

[DeletedUser9596]

another ship 10k dias
another colossus 35k dias

The prices are getting more and more outrageous

 

[Feanor II]

another ship 10k dias
another colossus 35k dias

The prices are getting more and more outrageous

At the very least they could take the fillers out of the TD rewards

 

[DeletedUser]

then you should have spent your money for more ships

 

[DeletedUser]

Is it intended for Silver and Gold league awards to each now have two Colossus upgrades?

Yes it is intended.

 

[FrejaSP]

another ship 10k dias
another colossus 35k dias

The prices are getting more and more outrageous

I believe it is fine, 1-2 extra ships are fine, but I had seen some with 20 ships, I do not like that.
I do not wish to see lots of colossus in same town.
This town are on a young server.

 

[DeletedUser4379]

' . . . but they don't always tell us why they do something.'

Quantifiable evidence shows they don't have a single clue themselves.

 

[LordVaderIII]

Even with the balancing changes, I'm still not sure we'll be able to get a fully upgraded colossus for free.

Mine is currently level 5 and there are only 11 days left in the event. I've already passed the 2,000 football reward at 30 quests. There's two more quest rewards (40 and 50) and I am just over midfield with 35 footballs in my inventory (the next reward is an upgrade kit).

I think we're still going to cut it very close to getting a completed colossus without spending a few diamonds.

 

[Feanor II]

Quantifiable evidence shows they don't have a single clue themselves.

"It's a tale as old as time. Great product, lousy sales division"
-Jack Gallo

 

[DeletedUser5383]

Even with the balancing changes, I'm still not sure we'll be able to get a fully upgraded colossus for free.

Mine is currently level 5 and there are only 11 days left in the event. I've already passed the 2,000 football reward at 30 quests. There's two more quest rewards (40 and 50) and I am just over midfield with 35 footballs in my inventory (the next reward is an upgrade kit).

I think we're still going to cut it very close to getting a completed colossus without spending a few diamonds.

Same here I have just received 2 upgrades, one from quest 40, and another from a TD with the balls received from the 40 quest, this has made my Colossus Lvl 7. I'm in silver by the skin of my teeth by 7 points, 567/560.
I make it 7 yards per 105 balls with 2400 more balls coming with quests and daily rewards in the next 10 days. (I have 4 balls left now as it stands) I have had 1 pass on the next field for which I'm heading for a shrink kit as reward.
It takes approx 11.4 goes at 105 to score a TD starting at the 20yd line, so I should just squeak in another upgrade from the the TD's making it Lvl 8?

What Inno dev's seem to think is I'll score the other 2 from being in silver, not going to happen.
Last year I was in a similar position concerning the medal table being in silver all the way, until the last day when I got booted down to Bronze, why? Because there's a lot of peeps out there saving their balls for daily prizes and when they have whats left over on the last day, just spend the lot affecting the amount needed to stay in silver.

And on a last note, all I hear are references here and on ingame messages to peeps having 2k of balls in the re-balance, I only had 1.5k??

 

[xivarmy]

Same here I have just received 2 upgrades, one from quest 40, and another from a TD with the balls received from the 40 quest, this has made my Colossus Lvl 7. I'm in silver by the skin of my teeth by 7 points, 567/560.
I make it 7 yards per 105 balls with 2400 more balls coming with quests and daily rewards in the next 10 days. (I have 4 balls left now as it stands) I have had 1 pass on the next field for which I'm heading for a shrink kit as reward.
It takes approx 11.4 goes at 105 to score a TD starting at the 20yd line, so I should just squeak in another upgrade from the the TD's making it Lvl 8?

What Inno dev's seem to think is I'll score the other 2 from being in silver, not going to happen.
Last year I was in a similar position concerning the medal table being in silver all the way, until the last day when I got booted down to Bronze, why? Because there's a lot of peeps out there saving their balls for daily prizes and when they have whats left over on the last day, just spend the lot affecting the amount needed to stay in silver.

And on a last note, all I hear are references here and on ingame messages to peeps having 2k of balls in the re-balance, I only had 1.5k??

In general you need to spend diamonds to be in the top 5% (silver) of an event. While it's going on being a keener that's ahead of everyone in quest completions can do the trick but in the last days the procrastinaters will start catching up and it'll be the ones that spent a little bit of diamonds that wind up in silver.

You are due to get 1 more upgrade from touchdowns, 1 upgrade from finishing in bronze which now gives one, 1 upgrade from quest 50. Which should get you to level 10.

 

[DeletedUser]

references here and on ingame messages to peeps having 2k of balls in the re-balance, I only had 1.5k??

The amount would vary between players depending on their progress in the event at the time of the changes, for example number of touchdowns and how many completed quests.

 

[FrejaSP]

Even with the balancing changes, I'm still not sure we'll be able to get a fully upgraded colossus for free.

Mine is currently level 5 and there are only 11 days left in the event. I've already passed the 2,000 football reward at 30 quests. There's two more quest rewards (40 and 50) and I am just over midfield with 35 footballs in my inventory (the next reward is an upgrade kit).

I think we're still going to cut it very close to getting a completed colossus without spending a few diamonds.

Same here, I'm level 6, now 10 days left, 415 balls i stock, 40 quests done, I will get 1 upgrade from last quest, hopeful one from Bronze. I will get 1 more from Touchdown but I will need to get 2. I hope I will make it.

 

[DeletedUser5383]

In general you need to spend diamonds to be in the top 5% (silver) of an event. While it's going on being a keener that's ahead of everyone in quest completions can do the trick but in the last days the procrastinaters will start catching up and it'll be the ones that spent a little bit of diamonds that wind up in silver.

You are due to get 1 more upgrade from touchdowns, 1 upgrade from finishing in bronze which now gives one, 1 upgrade from quest 50. Which should get you to level 10.

I think your right, I forgot to add the 50 upgrade, thanks for the reminder

 

[Thunderbummy]

I understand that players want more than one, but at this time it would appear game design does not want them to have more than one. I will see what I can find out about the intent, but they don't always tell us why they do something.

I might be inclined to agree with your thoughts except that the "Black Friday Sales" offered both Tholos & Ship upgrades. Surely the way to have happy customers is to give them what they want which in this case is Colossus upgrades available as daily special prizes and the opportunity to gain an extra level 1 building or 2.

 

[Emberguard]

10 levels needed and approximately 4K diamonds per level, that is just toooo much for many of us.

If this building is a new tier of power upgrade effectively (and at 14% attack boost with 6 FP in VF I'd say it is), they're charging for the whales.

Yeah, looking at my own bank statements 40,000 diamonds is 4x what it cost for each additional Pillar of Heroes/Tholos of Idols/Ship - whereas the building itself is only at best 1.5-2x better depending on whether you value goods that the other buildings provided. The FPs and Attack bonus are really what this event building would be bought for - and on those aspects it's more expensive then buying a GB in Virtual Future.

That in itself isn't a problem for the players that intend to play for free as long as it's reasonably easy to obtain a single Colossus lvl 10 for free. But for diamond buying cities that want additional it'll likely be a stretch

i haven't done any math myself though so I'd need to look into the new figures to see just how accurate 4k per level is

 

[xivarmy]

Yeah, looking at my own bank statements 40,000 diamonds is 4x what it cost for each additional Pillar of Heroes/Tholos of Idols/Ship - whereas the building itself is only at best 1.5-2x better depending on whether you value goods that the other buildings provided. The FPs and Attack bonus are really what this event building would be bought for - and on those aspects it's more expensive then buying a GB in Virtual Future.

That in itself isn't a problem for the players that intend to play for free as long as it's reasonably easy to obtain a single Colossus lvl 10 for free. But for diamond buying cities that want additional it'll likely be a stretch

i haven't done any math myself though so I'd need to look into the new figures to see just how accurate 4k per level is

It'd be a bit bit less than 40k each (you'd probably buy them when you got bonus balls, 2k diamonds of balls is a bit more than a touchdown, the first extra colossus would also take the extra upgrade from finishing silver/gold as well saving you an upgrade, not sure if it's 18 touchdowns per extra one in general or 20 (if the level 1 building is in place of one of the upgrades or is in between two upgrades)).

 

[Emberguard]

Every event comes with bundled event currency in specials so it makes no difference to compare it via specials unless those specials are of greater value then previous events.

I wouldn't want to be relying on the league to get me an extra upgrade when hunting for additional buildings. It'd be very easy to misjudge that and either come up short due to other players bumping oneself off the league, or put in too much and end up with a odd extra one in my inbox like with the tholos. Although given the price tag it'd be unlikely a gold league would be bumped down below silver league and if you are going for a second building you'd be more likely to be in the gold then the silver to begin with

I absolutely love the idea of the league, but I see it more as a added bonus to help you along a little more rather then something to rely upon

It's possible they've decided to price it out of comparative range to prevent it being spammed in peoples cities, but if that's the concern it could just as easily been handled in the same way historical questlines and the halloween event work for the actual main building so it's not available in Grand Prize/Daily Special but guaranteed a full building if you complete all quests and relegate everything else to the random prize pool with the Pillar of Heroes being the main side attraction for diamond spenders