Feedback Try out Guild Perks on Beta!

[jtrucker]

You get 10 different Perks each cycle. Even if some Perks are the same they will be 0 progress "from scratch".
They work like every other cycle related aspect of this game, nothing from the previous cycle remains.
Maybe this will change, like @Juber mentions a couple of times, some aspects of this particular addition to the game are subject to change after we test it here)

Sorry, how do you know that?
It really WAS NOT stated as clearly as you just said it. so
either you are a programmer/ admin of the game and do not have that title at your name
or you are guessing as much as we all are.

You might be right. Actually I think you ARE right. But, regardless of what I think, it is still only guess, unless you have the inside info. Because "outside" it really, seriously was not said as clearly as you did, so how do you know?

 

[Devilsangel]

Sorry, how do you know that?
It really WAS NOT stated as clearly as you just said it. so
either you are a programmer/ admin of the game and do not have that title at your name
or you are guessing as much as we all are.

You might be right. Actually I think you ARE right. But, regardless of what I think, it is still only guess, unless you have the inside info. Because "outside" it really, seriously was not said as clearly as you did, so how do you know?

From announcement: Each cycle (typically a 3-week period), a selection of Perks will be made available to all Guilds. These selections will change each cycle, and at the start of a new cycle, a whole new selection of Perks will be provided.

How is it still not clear from the announcement and @Juber's first reply in this thread?

 

[Devilsangel]

But that is only the way it is now

Reading this part, I came up with an idea to change the feature, so I took some inspiration from the feedback already provided. Also the % are made up.
Instead of resetting all the perks to 0, they could loose some progress every week. You could completely remove the 3 week cycle. I think the idea can be best explained by an example:
Let's say initially there are 10 perks to choose from. You can contribute to any perk you want and a maximum of 3 perks can be activated. So far it is the same. Instead of separating the 3 levels into separate bars, have one bar with 3 milestones: One for level 1, one for level 2 and one for level 3. This might sound minor, but is important for this one: After the first week your guild looses 10% of progress for every perk, with always a minimum of 100k points. After that calculation, every perk with 0 progress will be exchanged with another, new one. After the second week all perks, that stayed will loose 20% of their progress and the others only 10%. So after each week every perk that stayed will loose 10% more progress. This is important, because guilds should change their perks around a bit and not have the same 3 perks every week. How much progress a perk will loose could be shown, when you click on the perk to see the details.
If you want to change it to happen every 3rd week (to stay at the initial 3 week cycle, so that you don't get too many new perks in a short amount of time), you can just increase the percentages, to like 20% (which would mean a guild would have a perk for max 5 cycles, but to keep it, it will be very expansive).
To avoid being stuck with a perk you leveled and don't want the huge drawback next cycle, you could maybe have an option to mark a perk as 'exchange', so it will be removed in the next cycle. This one could be bound to guild leaders.

To expand on the 'specialization' part: It would be a good idea to show the current active perks in the guild profile. If you click on it you get information on what level this perk currently is and what the benefits are.

 

[Owl II]

But that is only the way it is now

Nooo! This is a primitive implementation now which does not provide for any control and no data storage outside the cycle. Juber suggests making sense of it. And he offers to store and calculate data on all perks of all guilds. At least there is much more logic in this than in the proposal to use the perks of the previous cycle in the next cycle.

 

[jtrucker]

From announcement: Each cycle (typically a 3-week period), a selection of Perks will be made available to all Guilds. These selections will change each cycle, and at the start of a new cycle, a whole new selection of Perks will be provided.

Yes, where does it say "Activated and leveled up perk will be deactivated and deleted"? I don't see this in your quote (nor anywhere else in the announcements. I was looking for specifically this info quite carefully). The announcement says only that each 3 weeks new/different perks to choose from will be available .. and then it was clearly stated that perks NOT FINISHED leveling/activating - the progress will reset.
But nowhere was ever stated that already ACTIVATED / FINISHED leveling perks will disappear.
Mind you, knowing Inno, I do believe myself that it is the case. But really, it is still only our guess, because nobody from the "upper echelons" said it (not yet anyway)

 

[Owl II]

because nobody from the "upper echelons" said it (not yet anyway)

But he did it

 

[drakenridder]

Reading this part, I came up with an idea to change the feature, so I took some inspiration from the feedback already provided. Also the % are made up.
Instead of resetting all the perks to 0, they could loose some progress every week. You could completely remove the 3 week cycle. I think the idea can be best explained by an example:
Let's say initially there are 10 perks to choose from. You can contribute to any perk you want and a maximum of 3 perks can be activated. So far it is the same. Instead of separating the 3 levels into separate bars, have one bar with 3 milestones: One for level 1, one for level 2 and one for level 3. This might sound minor, but is important for this one: After the first week your guild looses 10% of progress for every perk, with always a minimum of 100k points. After that calculation, every perk with 0 progress will be exchanged with another, new one. After the second week all perks, that stayed will loose 20% of their progress and the others only 10%. So after each week every perk that stayed will loose 10% more progress. This is important, because guilds should change their perks around a bit and not have the same 3 perks every week. How much progress a perk will loose could be shown, when you click on the perk to see the details.
If you want to change it to happen every 3rd week (to stay at the initial 3 week cycle, so that you don't get too many new perks in a short amount of time), you can just increase the percentages, to like 20% (which would mean a guild would have a perk for max 5 cycles, but to keep it, it will be very expansive).
To avoid being stuck with a perk you leveled and don't want the huge drawback next cycle, you could maybe have an option to mark a perk as 'exchange', so it will be removed in the next cycle. This one could be bound to guild leaders.

To expand on the 'specialization' part: It would be a good idea to show the current active perks in the guild profile. If you click on it you get information on what level this perk currently is and what the benefits are.

Personally I agreed the idea of weekly losing progress but I disagreed with being forced to switch around. As it's already disappointing that we'll lose our investments in perks after some time. With setting an cap to 5w its better then now but still it's a lose of precious investments over time none the less. Which would defeat the original person's suggestion; to making guilds work to keeping their chosen perk or losing it over time, due to deterioration. In that way similar to GE levels a guild can choose to continue to invest in the perks of their liking, or losing it over time. As this is a strategy game I think choosing up to 3 perks indefinitely and dealing with the drawbacks are the best to developing more advanced guild strategies and more specialised guilds. Which I think is the idea behind the perks. I agreed that the guild should be able to drop chosen perks whenever they please.

 

[CrashBoom]

Yes, where does it say "Activated and leveled up perk will be deactivated and deleted"? I don't see this in your quote (nor anywhere else in the announcements. I was looking for specifically this info quite carefully). The announcement says only that each 3 weeks new/different perks to choose from will be available .. and then it was clearly stated that perks NOT FINISHED leveling/activating - the progress will reset.
But nowhere was ever stated that already ACTIVATED / FINISHED leveling perks will disappear.
Mind you, knowing Inno, I do believe myself that it is the case. But really, it is still only our guess, because nobody from the "upper echelons" said it (not yet anyway)

the progress will be reset completely

reaching a level is also a progress





lets remember the conversation

Will subsequent cycles progress be reset

they will reset completely each cycle.

 

[NoVa]

When can we expect to see any change made to this feature for which the community's feedback should be, this time, taken into consideration - next cycle? Or is it gonna end up like the Heal All button followed by months of no change, silence, or, at best, empty words. I want to be proven wrong and actually see the devs stand to the repeated phrases of valuing our feedback instead of making something they deem as "useful addition" to the game.

 

[Prom d Exolandia]

But nowhere was ever stated that already ACTIVATED / FINISHED leveling perks will disappear.

Change your song... a reset is a reset.
Everyone (either you) have understood all is reset (in that version of implementation)

 

[CrashBoom]

a reset is a reset.

and "reset completely" is even more

 

[Pachom]

Well, inno, i did like most your new Features, the castle system e.g. ...
But i dislike this new one, because it causes a lot controversy in guilds,
brings pressure to The guild, i guess, many will leave the game.
Better you never take this junk to the liveservers.
Sorry, but that ist my honest and earnest feedback.
Pachom

 

[DEADP00L]

@Pachom :
You really didn't understand anything about the purpose of this topic!
If you just say you don't like it, it doesn't advance the debate and worse, it doesn't allow Inno to improve on this novelty.

Explain what you don't like and what you would prefer to have, it will be more constructive than your unnecessary crying.

 

[BabaORiley]

I suggest that FOE is renamed to FOW - Forge of Wasted time.
All players of the renamed game will be glad about new features as Mughal Empire or Guild Perks.
The others most probably are not...

 

[Yekk]

Well, inno, i did like most your new Features, the castle system e.g. ...
But i dislike this new one, because it causes a lot controversy in guilds,
brings pressure to The guild, i guess, many will leave the game.
Better you never take this junk to the liveservers.
Sorry, but that ist my honest and earnest feedback.
Pachom

He did DEADPOOL...

 

[DEADP00L]

No Yekk, he doesn't!
Inno asks us for ideas to improve the advantages of guilds or for specific observations on the problems encountered.
There we just have a complaint without anything specific.
Why does the system seem controversial to his guild?
We can only imagine ourselves based on OUR experience.

What I can say is that my guild has evolved like a family, we all have the same desires, the same goals.
If this principle of advantages calls into question certain members within guilds, it is a deeper problem.
How many guilds are recruiting without asking the right questions, the goal is just to be more numerous.
However, the guilds which prioritize the quality of the members to the quantity will not find the principle of advantages of guilds as a controversy.

Conclusion: yes to complain but by justifying to better understand the situation, not just come and cry to demonstrate your lack of reasoning.

 

[Yekk]

No Yekk, he doesn't!
Inno asks us for ideas to improve the advantages of guilds or for specific observations on the problems encountered.
There we just have a complaint without anything specific.
Why does the system seem controversial to his guild?
We can only imagine ourselves based on OUR experience.

What I can say is that my guild has evolved like a family, we all have the same desires, the same goals.
If this principle of advantages calls into question certain members within guilds, it is a deeper problem.
How many guilds are recruiting without asking the right questions, the goal is just to be more numerous.
However, the guilds which prioritize the quality of the members to the quantity will not find the principle of advantages of guilds as a controversy.

Conclusion: yes to complain but by justifying to better understand the situation, not just come and cry to demonstrate your lack of reasoning.

How does an addition that hurts a portion of your guild so others benefit do that without causing drama or losing members? Lets take full guild of 80. A diverse group in multiple ages. Some lower ages, some in SaV. Tell me which to hurt... which to force to donate so they get hurt... As I have siad earlier I will not be enabling buffs from this addon on my live world. It may just get me new recruits from guilds that do...To do otherwise would be just mean...

 

[DEADP00L]

Just like you, in the current state I will not validate it on my direct worlds.
However, if Inno modifies based on our constructive feedback and this favors the guilds in which ALL members participate because beforehand the gains are greater than the donations AND that this requires a thoughtful management of participation, I will be the first to study the advantages, the cost / gain ratio they will generate and a method within my guild to encourage everyone to be more efficient.

If you start from the premise that the novelty sucks and that it is not worth trying to improve it, why are you intervening here?

 

[Yekk]

Hmm because the CM said:
" There will PROBABLY be some major changes/improvements, before it will be released on the live servers " when asked if changes would done before it goes to live.

This tells me it is already has a "release to live date"....that nothing will change...that many will be hurt..., We have 11 pages of players asking for a remake, stating buffs are not worth the cost, that drama will occur, that in their beta guilds it already is. We also have every other additions feedback where Inno ignored the warnings and put out a second rate, third rate, or pure garbage addition.

 

[Juber]

This tells me it is already has a "release to live date"

No, there is not actually.

.that nothing will change...that many will be hurt..

The 'probably' was related to the 'major' part. There will be surely changes, but maybe not major ones.

We have 11 pages of players asking for a remake, stating buffs are not worth the cost, that drama will occur, that in their beta guilds it already is.

Which I all forwarded to the developers. They know, that the initial feedback was mainly negative, so there will be changes for sure.