Aerendil
Squire
the other path is greyed out, can cant complete encounters there
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Feedback Quantum Incursions
- Thread starter Leones
- Start date
Atosha
Merchant
Quantum Incursion, hum, so much to say...
Let's start with the beginning: thanks Inno to develop a new feature. But well, I am - to say the least - quite wary with the result.
A/ Visual
I hope this is the part which was already planned to get its finishing touches.
Why have a nice visual to put something linear unrelated to it?
There are a bunch of details that needs better care, a lot being already said: better access of settlements (some guild mates didn't even notice there was a building part), icon to inform we have something to collect (quantum city, quantum pass), reward icon is taking too much place, fp bar overlaps... And please, replace GvG menu icon by QI as well.
We also choose a specific incursion (Basiliks Peaks - what's the name gotta do with it or with iron age by the way) but it appears nowhere but at the start for the 1st quantum officer connected. I guess there will be others, if names aren't known, choosing will be hard.
B/ Game mechanism
I have tried now QI a few days, there are some interesting things like immediate production of units and goods, or the fact it doesn't impact guild treasury for once but too many bads.
B1- that new feature needs a lot more explanations before being ready to go live. Use of different new inventions (Quantum shards - you don't even mention the reward box purchase!, Quantum Actions, what is common within the guild and what is individual, how rewards works (nothing after clearing a level)...) or the re-used one that have a different role (come on decorations costs happiness, cultural buildings do not need roads... just call them differently! - I do understand though the design being kept).
B2- I think you have done wrong with basing this feature on the cultural settlement system. Adding something that will be deleted every 2 weeks and that is on top of that based on build/rebuild once or twice every day is not what will give the, I quote, "thrills" to FoE players. You should have the statistics, what percentage of the active players are doing settlements every 2 weeks again and again? And from that, what percentage when they have "finished" each type?
On top of that, you did announce as an objective to "reduce Repetitive Tasks". I can't relate QI and that objective.
B3- I think the node requirements should be adapted according to the guild size. Your game is too much intended towards large guilds and therefore shorten again the % of players you'll attract.
There's already a big advantage within large guild by being able to specialize (battles, goods suppliers, coin/supplies).
I have to add it seems Inno is trying to get us in that direction as GBG update was also a step towards that (number of fights + treasury for GQ camp). Last guild level bonus change could have been a way to even more the gap but with QI as it is, it seems clear.
B4- Finally, having no connection at all with our main city, nor sense of progress is another thorn in your feature to create a thrilling and engaging gaming experience.
3/ Game principle
Here's what I understand from Inno intent:
- Feature unconnected with the progress of a player, to even old and new players
However, I have to say I'm quite disappointed, especially regarding the spoilers we had that were promising more than this.
I'd like to remind that a feature's success is mainly based if it answers to players needs, generally fun (hum), progress (hum) and rewards (here but not well explained and understood yet).
And there could have been things like :
- A guild city, that would serve as base for the settlement and help every guild mate. Making that city progress would also give more interest in the game
- Heroes, that could evolve (the "future of FoE" announcement even said "Quantum Incursions: A new raid system featuring Heroes",
- Some partial transfer (%) of city bonuses (that could even give more weight to celtic tavern supplies bonus or other long forgotten buildings)
- ...
And of course, I'm not speaking about the huge amount of supplies required + the 10-hours wait making the 11 days granted for one incursion seems short.
Conclusion: we have many new players in our beta guild that came especially to test the new feature, eagerly. Experienced players. A lot if not all are disappointed. They miss the fun, and would have had more cooperation and strategy as well.
Let's start with the beginning: thanks Inno to develop a new feature. But well, I am - to say the least - quite wary with the result.
A/ Visual
I hope this is the part which was already planned to get its finishing touches.
Why have a nice visual to put something linear unrelated to it?
There are a bunch of details that needs better care, a lot being already said: better access of settlements (some guild mates didn't even notice there was a building part), icon to inform we have something to collect (quantum city, quantum pass), reward icon is taking too much place, fp bar overlaps... And please, replace GvG menu icon by QI as well.
We also choose a specific incursion (Basiliks Peaks - what's the name gotta do with it or with iron age by the way) but it appears nowhere but at the start for the 1st quantum officer connected. I guess there will be others, if names aren't known, choosing will be hard.
B/ Game mechanism
I have tried now QI a few days, there are some interesting things like immediate production of units and goods, or the fact it doesn't impact guild treasury for once but too many bads.
B1- that new feature needs a lot more explanations before being ready to go live. Use of different new inventions (Quantum shards - you don't even mention the reward box purchase!, Quantum Actions, what is common within the guild and what is individual, how rewards works (nothing after clearing a level)...) or the re-used one that have a different role (come on decorations costs happiness, cultural buildings do not need roads... just call them differently! - I do understand though the design being kept).
B2- I think you have done wrong with basing this feature on the cultural settlement system. Adding something that will be deleted every 2 weeks and that is on top of that based on build/rebuild once or twice every day is not what will give the, I quote, "thrills" to FoE players. You should have the statistics, what percentage of the active players are doing settlements every 2 weeks again and again? And from that, what percentage when they have "finished" each type?
On top of that, you did announce as an objective to "reduce Repetitive Tasks". I can't relate QI and that objective.
B3- I think the node requirements should be adapted according to the guild size. Your game is too much intended towards large guilds and therefore shorten again the % of players you'll attract.
There's already a big advantage within large guild by being able to specialize (battles, goods suppliers, coin/supplies).
I have to add it seems Inno is trying to get us in that direction as GBG update was also a step towards that (number of fights + treasury for GQ camp). Last guild level bonus change could have been a way to even more the gap but with QI as it is, it seems clear.
B4- Finally, having no connection at all with our main city, nor sense of progress is another thorn in your feature to create a thrilling and engaging gaming experience.
3/ Game principle
Here's what I understand from Inno intent:
- Feature unconnected with the progress of a player, to even old and new players
==> I understand the intent but that seems a mistake to have no link at all (except forgotten temple and tourney grounds)
- Make people specialize their QI city more than a "all-nodes-covering" city==> I'd say why not, that is indeed something different but why not introduce roles that could give bonus and malus then?
- Go back to basics and manual fights==> Again, why not but I think there should be incentives for that. As unit and goods producing takes 0 time, we could also imagine 0 time healing for the units still alive: it would be more easily to do a serie of battles (and if people wants to spend diamonds, it will be to revive troops)
- Re-visit the different ages and especially the initial ones for "old" playersHowever, I have to say I'm quite disappointed, especially regarding the spoilers we had that were promising more than this.
I'd like to remind that a feature's success is mainly based if it answers to players needs, generally fun (hum), progress (hum) and rewards (here but not well explained and understood yet).
And there could have been things like :
- A guild city, that would serve as base for the settlement and help every guild mate. Making that city progress would also give more interest in the game
- Heroes, that could evolve (the "future of FoE" announcement even said "Quantum Incursions: A new raid system featuring Heroes",
- Some partial transfer (%) of city bonuses (that could even give more weight to celtic tavern supplies bonus or other long forgotten buildings)
- ...
And of course, I'm not speaking about the huge amount of supplies required + the 10-hours wait making the 11 days granted for one incursion seems short.
Conclusion: we have many new players in our beta guild that came especially to test the new feature, eagerly. Experienced players. A lot if not all are disappointed. They miss the fun, and would have had more cooperation and strategy as well.
wwwoodchuck
Merchant
It is not one Season yet, but I can feel the time constraints will be heavy for QI. I cannot comment on the actual game play as I have only been concerned with productions in my Quantum Settlement. That has taken up all my time. I apologize if any of these items has already been addressed. The defect reporting forum does not have separate lists for each release or a spreadsheet one could look at to see defects or issues still open or resolved ‘at a glance’.
Without knowing what Inno actually intended for many moving parts of QI, here is my initial input:
Add more production timers in the Quantum Settlement that mirror the main cities productions. There is nothing else in the game set at 10 hours, and 10 hours only. I cannot think of any rational reason to have started a different set of timers for this part of the game.
The instantaneous building of certain structures in the Quantum Settlement is a nice addition for quality of user life. A complaint in the Cultural Settlements was the time it took to tear down and rebuild. By having structures ready immediately this alleviates that major complaint. It is a very welcome addition. Especially given the rapid time constraints to produce large quantities of Settlement products.
Change the Quantum Settlement graphics. Give users something unique to work with. It is supposed to be a new addition to the game, why use graphics from the ‘old game’ for it. Create new graphics for units, buildings, goods. Even if you use the Iron Age specifications for them all, it will have the appearance of something new and different. Make the game visually appealing. Making them completely different than any of the existing ages or Cultural Settlements would have gone a long way to making the Quantum settlement more interesting.
Change the interface with the Quantum map. It would have been much more pleasing to see the path follow the underlying graphic, as GE does. Having the out of place cubic path to follow is visually unappealing and very unprofessional. It is something one might expect in early peer testing, not UAT. It looks like it was just ‘thrown together’ or rushed.
Better communication from QI with the main city. There is no way to know what is going on in QI without going in and looking. Productions in the Quantum settlement need to have flags in the main city. There also needs to be a flag for the opening of a new Node. If I am waiting on the next Node to open so I can donate goods, I do not want to keep having to log on and visit the QI map each time. The Nodes are not on timers as in GbG or GE, they depend on users to complete them.
Something from the Quantum Settlements should carry over for the entire Championship. It is very awkward to have to start from square one each Season. At this early point, I do not know what that could be. If I had some documentation it would be faster to come up with a solution that would still satisfy company objectives.
Why can users not view the opposing armies without paying Quantum Actions on the <Move> button? It charges Quantum Actions each time the button is pressed, even if no other user action is performed. Is this the intended functionality?
The “Incursion Rewards” icon does not need to be such a major icon on the interface. It can be a separate tab on the “Guild Member Ranking” popup instead.
The “Quantum Ranking” button on the Back to City Menu should also be up in the Main Ranking menu popup. For conformity, I would expect to see the ranking and rewards for those ranking in one location, not scattered around.
Consistent placing of icons on the menu to insure conformity and user comfort. “The Army management (U)” icon on all other menu’s in in the upper right slot. Why change the location in this part of the game? Conformity of icon locations
Overall. It seems as if Beta got a very rushed piece of work. It would facilitate UAT if Beta received some sort of documentation on functionality of projects. None of us were in on any planning or meetings discussing this functionality. It is being thrown blind at us. The QI Announcement on the Beta Announcement forum is a far cry from user documentation. It is a very brief summary of some aspects of QI, not how anything should actually be functioning. The one part that does satisfy this documentation is the 6 descriptions and graphics of the Championship Shield graphic interface. This is the type of documentation I was expecting to have available. This lack of documentation, unfortunately, is going to lead to an inferior product being delivered to production or, an over lengthy time for projects in Beta.
Without knowing what Inno actually intended for many moving parts of QI, here is my initial input:
Add more production timers in the Quantum Settlement that mirror the main cities productions. There is nothing else in the game set at 10 hours, and 10 hours only. I cannot think of any rational reason to have started a different set of timers for this part of the game.
The instantaneous building of certain structures in the Quantum Settlement is a nice addition for quality of user life. A complaint in the Cultural Settlements was the time it took to tear down and rebuild. By having structures ready immediately this alleviates that major complaint. It is a very welcome addition. Especially given the rapid time constraints to produce large quantities of Settlement products.
Change the Quantum Settlement graphics. Give users something unique to work with. It is supposed to be a new addition to the game, why use graphics from the ‘old game’ for it. Create new graphics for units, buildings, goods. Even if you use the Iron Age specifications for them all, it will have the appearance of something new and different. Make the game visually appealing. Making them completely different than any of the existing ages or Cultural Settlements would have gone a long way to making the Quantum settlement more interesting.
Change the interface with the Quantum map. It would have been much more pleasing to see the path follow the underlying graphic, as GE does. Having the out of place cubic path to follow is visually unappealing and very unprofessional. It is something one might expect in early peer testing, not UAT. It looks like it was just ‘thrown together’ or rushed.
Better communication from QI with the main city. There is no way to know what is going on in QI without going in and looking. Productions in the Quantum settlement need to have flags in the main city. There also needs to be a flag for the opening of a new Node. If I am waiting on the next Node to open so I can donate goods, I do not want to keep having to log on and visit the QI map each time. The Nodes are not on timers as in GbG or GE, they depend on users to complete them.
Something from the Quantum Settlements should carry over for the entire Championship. It is very awkward to have to start from square one each Season. At this early point, I do not know what that could be. If I had some documentation it would be faster to come up with a solution that would still satisfy company objectives.
Why can users not view the opposing armies without paying Quantum Actions on the <Move> button? It charges Quantum Actions each time the button is pressed, even if no other user action is performed. Is this the intended functionality?
The “Incursion Rewards” icon does not need to be such a major icon on the interface. It can be a separate tab on the “Guild Member Ranking” popup instead.
The “Quantum Ranking” button on the Back to City Menu should also be up in the Main Ranking menu popup. For conformity, I would expect to see the ranking and rewards for those ranking in one location, not scattered around.
Consistent placing of icons on the menu to insure conformity and user comfort. “The Army management (U)” icon on all other menu’s in in the upper right slot. Why change the location in this part of the game? Conformity of icon locations
Overall. It seems as if Beta got a very rushed piece of work. It would facilitate UAT if Beta received some sort of documentation on functionality of projects. None of us were in on any planning or meetings discussing this functionality. It is being thrown blind at us. The QI Announcement on the Beta Announcement forum is a far cry from user documentation. It is a very brief summary of some aspects of QI, not how anything should actually be functioning. The one part that does satisfy this documentation is the 6 descriptions and graphics of the Championship Shield graphic interface. This is the type of documentation I was expecting to have available. This lack of documentation, unfortunately, is going to lead to an inferior product being delivered to production or, an over lengthy time for projects in Beta.
Retired Guy
Marquis
2 wave battles.. the 2nd wave doesn't match the initial screen..
Emberguard
Emperor
Hasn’t been released yet.
e2m2
Squire
Pretty sure that is Inno's grand master plan - they want people to play more and more because the more you play, the more likely you're going to eventually spend money.
Charles el Britannia
Marquis
On a now defunct blog by someone with access to a test server and insider information he mentioned that in the future there would be a global ranking of GBG, GE and QI combined.
That makes sense for Inno. Should a guild neglect one of the three, its ranking would suffer.
That makes sense for Inno. Should a guild neglect one of the three, its ranking would suffer.
lacsapgaah
Farmer
I suspect INNO of having restricted access to the Quantum Incursions tests only to browser players so as not to get criticism from app players.
It is not possible that this shoddy revolutionary feature is the result of paid work
It is not possible that this shoddy revolutionary feature is the result of paid work
Tempestas
Squire
Well, that was interesting. I just finished scanning 30 pages of comments. I'm glad I played before I read.
I have a bias. I never cared for GvG. I get that some people really enjoyed it and are sad that it is gone, but complaining about QI because GvG is gone is like complaining that your child isn't you. They are new, let them be their own version of fun.
I've been enjoying figuring out QI. I like figuring things out. I hear a lot of "we just want it to be easier" type complaining. I don't see any point in that. A puzzle is only a puzzle if it challenges you, It's only fun if the answer isn't immediately obvious. You only get to be proud if you had to work to figure out the answer.
Bugs. QI does have bugs. I just turned in one today.
Tutorial. True. It doesn't have a tutorial and that could be useful.
The look. Using old units, buildings, etc is a bit lazy and boring unless it's part of a larger picture that we don't see yet.
It has plenty of other cleaning up to do (like I agree I should know how long it's going to take a unit to heal). But that doesn't make it a bad concept.
Time. GE takes time. GBG takes a lot of time. Events take a lot of time. Now QI takes a lot of time. And it's obvious that things were made purposely dependent on each other. I need to do L5 of GE and/or enough fights in GBG to get the boosts I need for QI. Well, I had just decided I had enough of GBG because I don't like dealing with ... well never mind ... I can do GE & QI, so maybe it works for me. Others can do GBG & QI. And others can skip QI entirely just like I skipped GvG. But if someone out there is trying to do all of it, they may indeed become that goose killed for its golden eggs. I would caution Inno to be careful that if they make the game such that person feels they have to play all of it, that they have to be conscious of it 24 hours a day, that they will indeed kill their goose. While some folks will spend money on the game to cover their inability to be there 24 hours a day, no one is going to find a game interesting that largely about throwing money at it. That simple is not interesting. If I wanted to throw money, I would go buy something real.
I also do believe there is a reasonable complaint about whether a small guild can handle it. Perhaps a different competion that is only for small guilds that provides a reward that especially benefits small guilds .... I can imagine the game where you choose which competitions you do.
Of course, then the big guilds will cry that they can't have that too because they want everything and they think they earned it ... but you know what .... when the powerful cry because you got an ice cream and they didn't (and all they have to do is get out their purse), they just look silly.
My summary: QI is interesting. I kind of like it. It needs some work.
I have a bias. I never cared for GvG. I get that some people really enjoyed it and are sad that it is gone, but complaining about QI because GvG is gone is like complaining that your child isn't you. They are new, let them be their own version of fun.
I've been enjoying figuring out QI. I like figuring things out. I hear a lot of "we just want it to be easier" type complaining. I don't see any point in that. A puzzle is only a puzzle if it challenges you, It's only fun if the answer isn't immediately obvious. You only get to be proud if you had to work to figure out the answer.
Bugs. QI does have bugs. I just turned in one today.
Tutorial. True. It doesn't have a tutorial and that could be useful.
The look. Using old units, buildings, etc is a bit lazy and boring unless it's part of a larger picture that we don't see yet.
It has plenty of other cleaning up to do (like I agree I should know how long it's going to take a unit to heal). But that doesn't make it a bad concept.
Time. GE takes time. GBG takes a lot of time. Events take a lot of time. Now QI takes a lot of time. And it's obvious that things were made purposely dependent on each other. I need to do L5 of GE and/or enough fights in GBG to get the boosts I need for QI. Well, I had just decided I had enough of GBG because I don't like dealing with ... well never mind ... I can do GE & QI, so maybe it works for me. Others can do GBG & QI. And others can skip QI entirely just like I skipped GvG. But if someone out there is trying to do all of it, they may indeed become that goose killed for its golden eggs. I would caution Inno to be careful that if they make the game such that person feels they have to play all of it, that they have to be conscious of it 24 hours a day, that they will indeed kill their goose. While some folks will spend money on the game to cover their inability to be there 24 hours a day, no one is going to find a game interesting that largely about throwing money at it. That simple is not interesting. If I wanted to throw money, I would go buy something real.
I also do believe there is a reasonable complaint about whether a small guild can handle it. Perhaps a different competion that is only for small guilds that provides a reward that especially benefits small guilds .... I can imagine the game where you choose which competitions you do.
Of course, then the big guilds will cry that they can't have that too because they want everything and they think they earned it ... but you know what .... when the powerful cry because you got an ice cream and they didn't (and all they have to do is get out their purse), they just look silly.
My summary: QI is interesting. I kind of like it. It needs some work.
This blog was 100% fake and nothing written in there was confirmed. Some things were correct, yes, but just by posting so much stuff you will eventually guess something right. But this individual did not have access to any internal servers or information.
Tempestas
Squire
This is the bug I just turned in a ticket on. I did the math and concluded that the quantity displayed was wrong but that message about "too many citizens in employment" was correct. Sad. Of course I wanted it to be the other way around, lol.
Emberguard
Emperor
That and everything in it had already been put out as random guesses by players with zero info anyway
CDmark
Baronet
QS update....
here is where I saw it, in difficulty 6. The node with the Quantum Spotlight, like I am a Quantum Star
Here is the initial 2nd wave, showing 3 ballista
Then here is the 2nd wave after wave 1, think it copied the first wave. Happened that whole node, every battle.
I can't Quantum Say that I Quantum Saw it before. I doubt it bcs I am watching the enemy troops. You know, when there is a Quantum Shortage of A/D, one tends to Quantum Scan things a bit more. Like,
1) Did Quantum Sergio take his Quantum Steriods and has 125% A/D again? must Quantum See
2) Will I be able to Quantum Survive the 2nd wave after the wave 1 Quantum Skirmish?
I noticed the error bcs I know that I Quantum Saw 3 ballistas, but after the first Quantum Scrimmage, when I looked, I thought they did a Quantum Switch on me. It Quantum Showed the first wave again. So I went in, it was the Quantum Same as the initial information, 3 ballistas.
I was happy to see it was 3 ballista, I found some Quantum Solace.
Just4FoEbeta
Merchant
Two main issues with QI:
- sold as a replacement for GvG... well difficult to think about things less alike than GvG and QI
- out after that "future of FOE" speech: QI does not fit in
if presented as a new, independant feature... well, why not, boring as hell, but why not, there is already PVP that sucks, settlements that sucks, so another features that sucks? well it is only logical
but crucially: that speech speaking about less repetitive task, that idea of more specialists with different city development, etc.. GVG had it all
- anyone could participate and have fun with different approaches and goal, small and big guilds alike
- in guilds, people specialised: the fighters to do the fighting... duh..., the traders to get the goods, the small players for providing DAs. They were players coming every single day at reset, and those who came to enjoy once in a while, but to see everyone pulling their finger when asked for help was always something beautiful to witness, there was a sense of community.
- there was a real sense of competition for bragging rights, not for frags of another new OP buildings... that'll be bettered within a year or two
- some players spent really a lot on their city to be better at GvG, some none, but all enjoyed
- it was against real players (at least most of the time when FOE was still a game to enjoy), not like a PVP feature fighting against BOTs. It was against real guilds, not like QI where there is no raiding another guild
- there was strategies and wars going on over months (it takes time to deplete the treasury of an ennemy guild for ex.), diplomacy, backstabbing and coat turning, etc
in short, it was fun, versatile and had depth
then GBG came and the spirit of the game died
- sold as a replacement for GvG... well difficult to think about things less alike than GvG and QI
- out after that "future of FOE" speech: QI does not fit in
if presented as a new, independant feature... well, why not, boring as hell, but why not, there is already PVP that sucks, settlements that sucks, so another features that sucks? well it is only logical
but crucially: that speech speaking about less repetitive task, that idea of more specialists with different city development, etc.. GVG had it all
- anyone could participate and have fun with different approaches and goal, small and big guilds alike
- in guilds, people specialised: the fighters to do the fighting... duh..., the traders to get the goods, the small players for providing DAs. They were players coming every single day at reset, and those who came to enjoy once in a while, but to see everyone pulling their finger when asked for help was always something beautiful to witness, there was a sense of community.
- there was a real sense of competition for bragging rights, not for frags of another new OP buildings... that'll be bettered within a year or two
- some players spent really a lot on their city to be better at GvG, some none, but all enjoyed
- it was against real players (at least most of the time when FOE was still a game to enjoy), not like a PVP feature fighting against BOTs. It was against real guilds, not like QI where there is no raiding another guild
- there was strategies and wars going on over months (it takes time to deplete the treasury of an ennemy guild for ex.), diplomacy, backstabbing and coat turning, etc
in short, it was fun, versatile and had depth
then GBG came and the spirit of the game died
e2m2
Squire
What I noticed a few times is that when you add or remove houses or add or remove buildings that require population, the system doesn't always update the population number correctly. I have to reload FOE in browser and then it'll show the correct number of population. So yeah, it's a bug.
Tempestas
Squire
Wow. Reloading doesn't fix it for me.
Thunderdome
Emperor
Even though Inno fixed the issue with league standings (thanks Inno, heh heh), QI is still doing a number on the event minigame that I had to refresh the game just to make it work correctly. I wonder if every other event with a minigame is going to have the same problem...
mcbluefire
Baronet
Except for the fact that it's QI (although I like the funny spin since it is killing my IQ), I completely agree with the rest of your sentence. This is going to be so mind numbingly boring after we figure out the cookie cutter best recipe for the small city. Then more boring repetitive gameplay season after season mixed with the thousands upon thousands of clicks in GBG.....what's the point? Keep going so we can keep replacing all the buildings in our cities every couple of years
<sarcasm>Let me pull out my wallet.</sarcasm>
I know this wasn't directly stated anywhere, but I have to imagine that with Quantum in the name they aren't planning to keep us in Iron Age very long and eventually we'll be rotating through all the ages. Frankly, if that happens I can't imagine that being any better than just staying in Iron Age...as it will be same formula, different skins.