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Feedback Summer Event 2019

Emberguard

Emperor
no they don't.... do the maths and compare it to 4 small wells
are you considering the roads necessary in that assessment between 4 wells and one “nest”?

image0.png

I’ve removed a Himeji to make it easier to see what I’ve done with this layout. Now imagine you’ve got a “crows nest” and a bunch of Wells. If you’re able to surround every nest with smaller buildings is it still as inefficient in comparison as you think? I can’t do the same with just small buildings. I’d have to make those Wells run alongside roads (so instead of 2x3 (x4 buildings) making 4x6 it’d actually be 8x4 for little Wishing Wells on their own)

Now if you filled a city with only one type of building and nothing else, your assessment would /maybe/ be correct. There’d be no way to make the nest as efficient in that scenario if we’re doing a single nest and not two rows of nests compared to the same space filled with Wells. But if you use it in conjunction with other buildings in your layout you only need a single square of tile (maybe two) to connect the nest at the end or middle of a area
 
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1BFA

Viceroy
Was not able to go thru all pages, do we get ship upgrades? Because the selection kit doesn't have upgrade.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
My issue is, that small buildings, that can be polished steal stars from other buildings
You do realize there is a new polivate mechanism in action for some months now and those small buildings will never be auto polivated as long as you have better buildings around?

1-2 % coins, supply, defense or attack boost is not really worth a star.
Good thing you don't need a star for the boosts then, hm?

The Ritual Flame have same size but gives 8% defence boost without need to be polished
Ritual Flames don't provide happiness and the Guard Posts don't need polivation.

So... What is your point?
 

DeletedUser

Guest
Remove the option to polish The Guard Posts and give a little more boost. Keep the happiness as it is.
Actually, as far as I am concerned with my main world: the little buildings are much, much better as they are now, than this joke of a "main" building. I am taking any amount of attack boost in 2 squares anytime, thank you very much. You may as well remove happiness, I have 200k excess already.
 

DeletedUser10166

Guest
I like the fact that they are trying out a Wishing Well type building again. Yes i have a few cities loaded with wishing wells. No i wouldn't build a Hedge Maze in them because it's just not an efficient building for it's purpose. With that out of the way, lets looks at this new building and what would make it worth while.

Say whatever you want, the randomness of the production just limits the building to a point where it is not competitive with a typical specialized production building leaving the only reason to have a WW in you city is the diamond production. And based off of the average daily rewards that Inno has given this building compared to other recently released event buildings, we shouldn't look at it as anything other than a WW type building. With those two points said we need to look at why players would want this building, and that for it's diamond production.
So lets looks at it's diamond efficiency.
It's a 5x5 building that gives 100 diamonds at 1% chance so (100 diamonds divided by 25 squares times 1= 4 diamond production per square).
While a typical wishing well with a shrink kit can be brought down to 2x3 at 50 diamonds at 1% (50/6*1=8.33 diamonds per square).
Even a full sized WW beats it at 5.55 diamonds per square.
With these numbers, the building is not worth it for even diamond farm cities. And it makes one think that Inno wanted to give out a wishing well type building without it being too big of a diamond producer. And if that's the case, the only logical solution to this issue is to reduce it's size. I read through some posts in this thread saying the building graphics is complete therefor the building can not be made smaller. Just because the graphic is complete why does that mean they can't reduce it's footprint? Why can't they just reduce the image size. Sure maybe it will be a little out of scale but that's nothing they can't fix with a patch at a later time. The most important thing is getting the stats right to where it's useful but not overpowered.

With the above in mind, I think the most logical size would be 4x4 or 16 squares. At this size we then need to find what makes sense for diamond production.
100 diamonds divided by 16 squares times 1 = 6.25 diamonds per square. That's still not too good and considerable worse than shrunken WW's.
I think the best move at this point would be to double the diamond reward chance to 2%. Now that puts us at;
100/16*2=12.5 diamonds per square. At this rate it would be slightly less than 50% better than a handful of shrunken wishing wells and is finally an event worthy upgrade over a typically available building. A bit much? Maybe, but one thing Inno has surely focused on doing over the last year or two has been to put out extremely powerful event buildings. So i feel this reward is in line for this kind of building.

Finally, the weaker rewards can stay along with slightly reducing the primary (fp/goods) productions in line with the smaller building size, but i think small attack/defense boosts would be a nice addition to make this building more useful for the masses as opposed to just the diamond farmers. For added fluff i think the idea of unit production could add a interesting twist


Final building stats (4x4)
Permanent bonus
Small pop boost
Small Attack boost and or Defense boost

Daily random reward
2% 100 Diamonds
30% 10 fps (3 fps per day generating at 1fp per 5.3 squares)
30% 40 goods (12 goods per day generating at .75 goods per square per day)
10% medium medals (useful for some, useless for others)
10% Supplies (typically useless)
10% Coins (typically useless)
8% 3 of a random special unit production


Looking at the stats above, the building is weaker than the winter spire by giving up fp production and goods for diamond production. However it would still be desirable enough for most everyone as it would be in line with the fire pagoda given out in the spring event aside from maybe giving up half of the attack/defense bonus for the diamond production.

Maybe the stats still need to be brought down a little further to justify the diamond production. You are never going to please everyone. At the end of the day, if the developers are aiming at a wishing well type building that gives diamonds, the diamond reward really needs to be worthwhile over the currently available buildings in order to make it desirable.

I was hoping Inno would take another swing at this type of building and make it useful. I was dreaming up some sort of over the top awesome Atlantis civilization reward building, but i guess an event building will do for now :). Thanks Inno!
 

Emberguard

Emperor
are you considering the roads necessary in that assessment between 4 wells and one “nest”?

image0.png

I’ve removed a Himeji to make it easier to see what I’ve done with this layout. Now imagine you’ve got a “crows nest” and a bunch of Wells. If you’re able to surround every nest with smaller buildings is it still as inefficient in comparison as you think? I can’t do the same with just small buildings. I’d have to make those Wells run alongside roads (so instead of 2x3 (x4 buildings) making 4x6 it’d actually be 8x4 for little Wishing Wells on their own)

Now if you filled a city with only one type of building and nothing else, your assessment would /maybe/ be correct. There’d be no way to make the nest as efficient in that scenario if we’re doing a single nest and not two rows of nests compared to the same space filled with Wells. But if you use it in conjunction with other buildings in your layout you only need a single square of tile (maybe two) to connect the nest at the end or middle of a area
Continuing on from this ^



Rather then 1 crows nest for 4 Wells, we could compare 6 nests for 22 Wells to get a better comparison picture.
C3A139EB-84F1-4B8C-995B-AAB8CB923BCA.jpeg
9A2B699A-AFA4-4E7F-9AC5-0F53EF9DFACF.jpeg

Nest:
upload_2019-7-4_19-19-44.png
Vs
Well
FA616A43-7343-44D4-B6D9-FC20F69FF5E5.jpeg

Feel free to correct my math here if it’s wrong.
Assuming for the moment every building gave the same output on the same day
output6 nests22 wells
Diamonds600 (100x6)1,100 (50x22)
Forge Points90 (15x6)44 (2x22)
Goods300 (50x6)220 (22x10)
Medals4,800 (800x6)220 (22x10)
coins144,000 (24k x 6)55,440 (2,529x22)
Supplies144,000 (24k x 6)55,000 (2,500x22)

Does anyone disagree with my assessment of the output given (when comparing to Wishing Wells)? I’m thinking the diamond output is worse than wells but everything else is better for the output. According to the fan wiki the Wishing well % chance is basically reversed for goods / FPs and supplies / coins / medals, so you’d get the FPs and goods more often in a nest then a WW
 
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Emberguard

Emperor
I think the best move at this point would be to double the diamond reward chance to 2%.
If we want it to be a giant Wishing well and not it’s own thing, then I agree. That for diamonds would bring it in line with the little Wishing well
 

DeletedUser10167

Guest
Thanks for providing your feedback.
What changes would you suggest to make The Crow's Nest more attractive?

Eine gute Alternative ist immer eine Wahlmöglichkeit beim Upgrade auf die letzte Stufe:
- FP / Kampfboost / Verteidigung / Güter

5x5 kann funktionieren, aber die Werte (FP, Kampf, etc) sollten sich den früheren Eventgebäuden angleichen

Im Moment kann ich nicht erkennen, wieso ich es überhaupt haben soll oder gar wieso ich Diamanten auf meiner Hauptwelt kaufen sollten, um ggf. mehr als eines zu bekommen.

Dekoration: Der Verteidigungs-/Angriffsboost sollte besser sein, als bspw. bei einer Ritualflamme, die man aus der GE erhalten kann. Wieso sollte ich am Sommerrad Dublonen ausgeben, wenn ich sie in der GE bekommen kann. 2% Stadtverteidigung/Angriff sollt es mindestens sein,
ggf. sollte es eine 2. Stufe geben, womit man den Wert auf 3% erhöhen kann.

Eine Idee ist ggf. auch ein Upgrade des Schiffes auf Stufe 8 mit leicht besseren Werten, ggf. auch über Fragmente für Upgradekits.

Translation:
A good alternative is always a choice when upgrading to the last level:
- FP / Combat Boost / Defense / Goods

5x5 may work, but the values (FP, fight, etc) should be the same as the previous event buildings

At the moment I can not see why I should have it at all or even why I should buy diamonds on my main world, if necessary to get more than one.

Decoration: The Defense / Attack Boost should be better than, for example, a Ritual Flame that can be obtained from the GE. Why should I spend doubloons on the summer bike, if I can get them in the GE. 2% city defense / attack should be at least
if necessary, there should be a 2nd stage, which can increase the value to 3%.

An idea may also be an upgrade of the ship to level 8 with slightly better values, possibly including fragments for upgrade kits.

EDIT: NormaJeane - 2019-07-04
Please provide an English translation when you post on the Beta-forum in another language!
 
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Emberguard

Emperor
Eine gute Alternative ist immer eine Wahlmöglichkeit beim Upgrade auf die letzte Stufe:
- FP / Kampfboost / Verteidigung / Güter

5x5 kann funktionieren, aber die Werte (FP, Kampf, etc) sollten sich den früheren Eventgebäuden angleichen

Im Moment kann ich nicht erkennen, wieso ich es überhaupt haben soll oder gar wieso ich Diamanten auf meiner Hauptwelt kaufen sollten, um ggf. mehr als eines zu bekommen.

Dekoration: Der Verteidigungs-/Angriffsboost sollte besser sein, als bspw. bei einer Ritualflamme, die man aus der GE erhalten kann. Wieso sollte ich am Sommerrad Dublonen ausgeben, wenn ich sie in der GE bekommen kann. 2% Stadtverteidigung/Angriff sollt es mindestens sein,
ggf. sollte es eine 2. Stufe geben, womit man den Wert auf 3% erhöhen kann.

Eine Idee ist ggf. auch ein Upgrade des Schiffes auf Stufe 8 mit leicht besseren Werten, ggf. auch über Fragmente für Upgradekits.

Google Translation:
A good alternative is always a choice when upgrading to the last level:
- FP / Combat Boost / Defense / Goods

5x5 may work, but the values (FP, fight, etc) should be the same as the previous event buildings

At the moment I can not see why I should have it at all or even why I should buy diamonds on my main world, if necessary to get more than one.

Decoration: The Defense / Attack Boost should be better than, for example, a Ritual Flame that can be obtained from the GE. Why should I spend doubloons on the summer bike, if I can get them in the GE. 2% city defense / attack should be at least
if necessary, there should be a 2nd stage, which can increase the value to 3%.

An idea may also be an upgrade of the ship to level 8 with slightly better values, possibly including fragments for upgrade kits
 

In.My.ConTroL

Inhouse Community Manager
Thanks everyone for providing feedback on the feature.
We considered The Crow's Nest a strong new building, but the majority seems to disagree. Increasing the probabilities to get diamonds from 1% to 20% would make it unbalanced, so we don't think it's possible. Nevertheless, we'll make sure to forward all the feedback provided in this thread to the development team.
 
no they don't.... do the maths and compare it to 4 small wells
First of all, realistically you are not going to be able to fit 3 small wells into a 5x5 area, let alone 4. You are only going to be able to fit 2.
Second, I'm talking overall numbers, not just diamonds. Goods, FP, their %'s and medals are all higher with the Crows' Nest vs 4 wells. And diamonds would be equal to 2 wells.
 

Amdira

Baronet
Just change pobabilities for
diamonds from 1 to 5 % and
medals from 20 to 10%
and it would be real good
shrinking it to 4x4 would make it great :)

Just my 2 Cents
 

DeletedUser

Guest
First of all, realistically you are not going to be able to fit 3 small wells into a 5x5 area, let alone 4. You are only going to be able to fit 2.
Second, I'm talking overall numbers, not just diamonds. Goods, FP, their %'s and medals are all higher with the Crows' Nest vs 4 wells. And diamonds would be equal to 2 wells.
First of all, some great amount of players do not put WWs on their main world. So.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
We considered The Crow's Nest a strong new building, but the majority seems to disagree. Increasing the probabilities to get diamonds from 1% to 20% would make it unbalanced, so we don't think it's possible.
Why did you consider bigger WW with 8 levels to gain a strong building? But yes, 20% for diamonds would be very unbalanced.
 
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