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Feedback Guild Expedition Update
- Thread starter Juber
- Start date
This is happening because, they didn't reach there step by step to face the heavy targets/opponents with defense boost. If they have the chances from GE1-4 with defense boost, they will get to know the units capability to deal with defense boost from each encounter. In this way, it wont give the feel of angry or disappointment, since moving one by one encounter they will know the strength of units with defense boost visually or practically and get to know the weakness and strength to face the GE5 after completing GE4.
jovada
Regent
What a joke , just did the first tower, bought 2 buildings for negotiation total of 300 goods to build, cost is now reduced from 40 goods to 36.
If you don't buy it means that every round having nothing correct you pay 20 goods more, so 5 rounds nothing correct you pay 100 goods extra ( and really 5 rounds with nothing correct is unlikely) you pay 300 goods to save a max 100 goods whahahaha.
If you don't buy it means that every round having nothing correct you pay 20 goods more, so 5 rounds nothing correct you pay 100 goods extra ( and really 5 rounds with nothing correct is unlikely) you pay 300 goods to save a max 100 goods whahahaha.
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The capabilities are no different. You are still basically attacking, but just with defense boost.
The only reason for using defense boost is because the player base has neglected it so it's able to make GE5 difficult for a much wider cross-section (i.e. with the same quasi-insane numbers, but players still using attack boost, some people would be autobattling GE5 *now*). It's not some mysterious new way to fight. If you used defense boost for all levels, you'd effectively just be making all levels more difficult (because we're not built for it).
Bonnie McBoobs
Farmer
The "defense on second wave of battle" idea might would also be an interesting way to balance gbg without messing up siege camps.. also, if the autobattle ai was different (like how pvp is?), then it would make races more challenging as well.
diGriz
Farmer
so my results for GE5:
I consumed half of my defending boosts and was able to get the following stats:
- attack ~300 + fortification (50 - 110) = ~400
- defense ~2400
I was able to complete 12 encounters by fighting
the last four encounters I pass by negotiation and I've spent 20 diamonds (+1 attempt 2 times) for that and quite a lot of goods
verdict:
- reward does not worth the effort
- 50% attack bonus from the temple (4 weeks to get) looks miserable comparing to the final expedition point stats (2500+)
- will not go for 2nd attempt anytime soon
I consumed half of my defending boosts and was able to get the following stats:
- attack ~300 + fortification (50 - 110) = ~400
- defense ~2400
I was able to complete 12 encounters by fighting
the last four encounters I pass by negotiation and I've spent 20 diamonds (+1 attempt 2 times) for that and quite a lot of goods
verdict:
- reward does not worth the effort
- 50% attack bonus from the temple (4 weeks to get) looks miserable comparing to the final expedition point stats (2500+)
- will not go for 2nd attempt anytime soon
Carolynosb
Farmer
Hearing that GE Level 5 was coming out was so exciting something new! But after watching several video's figuring the cost it is like pulling the rug out from underneath me. Not worth the effort.
From watching several videos the cost for leveling GE5 around 10,000 goods, 100 diamonds, troops a week, so you will need to make around 1500 goods/ a day to substain GE5 every week. Goods from RQ, trades, other gb's etc could possibly be doable for negotiations.
Now if you tear up the real estate for only one level of GE5 you will loose out big time, possibly yrs of building up your cities just to tear down for 1 level of GE5 just for some frags? If you had say SBC & DC at level 111 that would only give you 162% att/def for your defending army, (up against 1900 to 2700 att/def against the enemy Is it worth trading your GBG city for that one level of GE5? I think not. It would take yrs to build up our city defense/attack.
Maybe a few could play this but not a whole guild, plus it is unfair for the majority that will not be able to play so if we all can't play I will not bother with GE level 5 unless changes are made for everyone.
From watching several videos the cost for leveling GE5 around 10,000 goods, 100 diamonds, troops a week, so you will need to make around 1500 goods/ a day to substain GE5 every week. Goods from RQ, trades, other gb's etc could possibly be doable for negotiations.
Now if you tear up the real estate for only one level of GE5 you will loose out big time, possibly yrs of building up your cities just to tear down for 1 level of GE5 just for some frags? If you had say SBC & DC at level 111 that would only give you 162% att/def for your defending army, (up against 1900 to 2700 att/def against the enemy Is it worth trading your GBG city for that one level of GE5? I think not. It would take yrs to build up our city defense/attack.
Maybe a few could play this but not a whole guild, plus it is unfair for the majority that will not be able to play so if we all can't play I will not bother with GE level 5 unless changes are made for everyone.
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One thought on how to keep the boosts so high but not make the prospect of getting stronger defensively feel like a wall where it does nothing until you're heavily invested:
Let our damage "stick". I.e. if we manage to kill 1 unit with our "defense", let it stay dead. If we want to burn 10+ waves of units to finish 1 encounter, let that be the price of having awful defense that we can improve incrementally. i.e. Get it down to 9 waves and save 8 units a week. Extra waves would also cost extra attempts. So we would be stretched on that front too by needing too many waves per encounter.
Let our damage "stick". I.e. if we manage to kill 1 unit with our "defense", let it stay dead. If we want to burn 10+ waves of units to finish 1 encounter, let that be the price of having awful defense that we can improve incrementally. i.e. Get it down to 9 waves and save 8 units a week. Extra waves would also cost extra attempts. So we would be stretched on that front too by needing too many waves per encounter.
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denhviteguden
Farmer
Who at inno comes up with these stupid ideas? Jeezz...
The only good idea inno had in years was put through a poll and died, here in beta. Or at least it is in a long coma, since one can still "fight" all day long with zero attrition in Guild Farming Ground in the real worlds.
Regarding this GE flicker of inspiration, innocheaters thought and thought on how can they force their rigged negotiations on us. Increasing boosts in enemy armies at level 4 did not work, and even doubling them at level 5 wouldn't have been worked either.
Now, the players that are actually good at this game and figured out a long time ago that defense army boost buildings are nothing but a dreadful waste of space, would need to either radically change their cities (will never happen), or negotiate the entire level 5. Victory for innocheaters at least!
...I won't do either, on principle. I don't even do the negotiations for SC anymore, I am THAT disgusted with their rigged rubbish.
Why don't you put THIS idea through a poll, inno? And when it gets its fill of thrown rotten eggs, let IT die here, in beta, like the epic fail it deserves to be.
The only good idea inno had in years was put through a poll and died, here in beta. Or at least it is in a long coma, since one can still "fight" all day long with zero attrition in Guild Farming Ground in the real worlds.
Regarding this GE flicker of inspiration, innocheaters thought and thought on how can they force their rigged negotiations on us. Increasing boosts in enemy armies at level 4 did not work, and even doubling them at level 5 wouldn't have been worked either.
Now, the players that are actually good at this game and figured out a long time ago that defense army boost buildings are nothing but a dreadful waste of space, would need to either radically change their cities (will never happen), or negotiate the entire level 5. Victory for innocheaters at least!
...I won't do either, on principle. I don't even do the negotiations for SC anymore, I am THAT disgusted with their rigged rubbish.
Why don't you put THIS idea through a poll, inno? And when it gets its fill of thrown rotten eggs, let IT die here, in beta, like the epic fail it deserves to be.
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Aerendil
Squire
I negotiated from Plattform 3, I am in SAJM and have plenty of goods and a high enough good production to negotiate every week.
Negotiating with 10 options needs luck and I spent some diamonds, won zero diamonds in Gex5.
Was it fun? No, negotiating with 10 options is more like work.
New players who are climbing the ages cant afford negotiating GEX, they cant afford fighting either because they need FP, goods and attacking boosts, so its only for max players.
Luckily in all my guilds, GEX is optional.
as already mentioned, the reduced cost for negotiotaing is useless, because it costs more goods than the reduction.
Change to either give +1 attempt or -1 option or reduce the costs
Some ideas for improvement:
The buldings have potential, make them stack.
Make all the buildings count for all encounters. This way the reduced cost for negotiating and reduced options would be fine. You still have to pay those buildings,
Same with fighting the Gex5. I havent counted all the attack and defense boosts but with all of them active, your chances are better. Maybe an extra kick of some potions or a new tavern boost is still needed, but no city redesign. You still have to pay the buildings. People with enough city def can save goods.
Negotiating with 10 options needs luck and I spent some diamonds, won zero diamonds in Gex5.
Was it fun? No, negotiating with 10 options is more like work.
New players who are climbing the ages cant afford negotiating GEX, they cant afford fighting either because they need FP, goods and attacking boosts, so its only for max players.
Luckily in all my guilds, GEX is optional.
as already mentioned, the reduced cost for negotiotaing is useless, because it costs more goods than the reduction.
Change to either give +1 attempt or -1 option or reduce the costs
Some ideas for improvement:
The buldings have potential, make them stack.
Make all the buildings count for all encounters. This way the reduced cost for negotiating and reduced options would be fine. You still have to pay those buildings,
Same with fighting the Gex5. I havent counted all the attack and defense boosts but with all of them active, your chances are better. Maybe an extra kick of some potions or a new tavern boost is still needed, but no city redesign. You still have to pay the buildings. People with enough city def can save goods.
The same ones who make the financial statements and who find the consequences:
where you can read this:
Innogames does not understand why it loses so many players and therefore money?
Who can explain to them that listening to their community does not mean opening a forum without any DIALOGUE?
Problem: People are no longer stuck at home in a pandemic, so growth in the gaming industry in general is down. GBG which is supposed to promote retention instead is promoting burnout.
Solution: Power Creep!?
As Mulder said, the solution is elsewhere!
Take the case of novelties, if they are badly accomplished (which seems to become a certain habit) the old players get tired while the new ones do not realize the novelty, so much they have to discover things. I would even say that it can put off a new player as there are so many different and strange things when you start.
While if Inno stopped disgusting players by fixing what is in place and does not work or less and less (by listening to the suggestions of players who analyze the game, for example), this would make it possible to retain old players while improving newbie experience.
Wanting to do too many events that now hides behind a "pay to win", or not establishing a dialogue with its community (as a reminder, a dialogue is not when only one party speaks), Inno tires the old who generally leaving the game weakens their guild which generates other departures.
Personally, if we won less but the gaming experience became pleasant again, I think I would spend money to stay longer. That currently, I stay to be able to chat with old friends while dissuading them from spending money unnecessarily.
I don't care about earning buildings that offer 150 FP and 750% attack, I wish I could mine the whole game without having to click 150,000 times for everyday actions.
There is no shortage of suggestions in this area, but none (to my knowledge) has been implemented since the 2021 sprint.
And Mb (boss of inno) is wondering about the flight of players?
No, it's not because of the end of the pandemic, the game was growing well before 2019. Its growth never stopped from 2014 to 2021, it's after it started to go downhill. I think they've lost some thinking heads and are too proud to admit their mistakes while getting back to talking with at least the beta community.
Take the case of novelties, if they are badly accomplished (which seems to become a certain habit) the old players get tired while the new ones do not realize the novelty, so much they have to discover things. I would even say that it can put off a new player as there are so many different and strange things when you start.
While if Inno stopped disgusting players by fixing what is in place and does not work or less and less (by listening to the suggestions of players who analyze the game, for example), this would make it possible to retain old players while improving newbie experience.
Wanting to do too many events that now hides behind a "pay to win", or not establishing a dialogue with its community (as a reminder, a dialogue is not when only one party speaks), Inno tires the old who generally leaving the game weakens their guild which generates other departures.
Personally, if we won less but the gaming experience became pleasant again, I think I would spend money to stay longer. That currently, I stay to be able to chat with old friends while dissuading them from spending money unnecessarily.
I don't care about earning buildings that offer 150 FP and 750% attack, I wish I could mine the whole game without having to click 150,000 times for everyday actions.
There is no shortage of suggestions in this area, but none (to my knowledge) has been implemented since the 2021 sprint.
And Mb (boss of inno) is wondering about the flight of players?
No, it's not because of the end of the pandemic, the game was growing well before 2019. Its growth never stopped from 2014 to 2021, it's after it started to go downhill. I think they've lost some thinking heads and are too proud to admit their mistakes while getting back to talking with at least the beta community.
MJ Artisan of War
Baronet
GE 5, Just another failed attempt by the genius INNOvators who don't play this game...
GateKeeper
Baronet
In an ironic twist.... Beta server is not the proper server to test GE lvl 5 difficulty right... I would 98% of beta play to test events, spec buildings, etc.... most of us don't build grand fighting stats and play beta like we do Live Servers,.... soooo just launch it next week GE lvl 5 on Live Servers!!!
Send a in-game notice for players to try it out next week, one week only...go back to lvl 4 afterwards while you collect the Live servers feedback...and get a better sense of how to nerf it.
ok going back sleep now, since I cant possibly get past Step 3 on LVL 5... 20 goods per Nego.
Send a in-game notice for players to try it out next week, one week only...go back to lvl 4 afterwards while you collect the Live servers feedback...and get a better sense of how to nerf it.
ok going back sleep now, since I cant possibly get past Step 3 on LVL 5... 20 goods per Nego.
bornempire
Steward
I thought about it after one night of extra sleep: The solution is time very simple. There are no players who can effort to pay 10 thousand goods per week. To finish GE V.
So the way it is designed is a self destructing system. LOL
No normal guild founder, if you have the choice between:
1. helping your guild with 10 K goods weekly to develop their cities and more fights for the guild
2. Cashburning over 10 K goods to do level GE V
Will choose for option 2.
So good luck Inno! The time bomb has started the clock.
So the way it is designed is a self destructing system. LOL
No normal guild founder, if you have the choice between:
1. helping your guild with 10 K goods weekly to develop their cities and more fights for the guild
2. Cashburning over 10 K goods to do level GE V
Will choose for option 2.
So good luck Inno! The time bomb has started the clock.
Correct, but everyone will have their chance on it. Let it be difficult, it's guild expedition championship, so be it on all levels of GEx with defense boost. This is doable and top level players shout for 2 weeks then later , they will also adapt to it. Same for low level players too, face the difficulty with defense boost from initial levels of GEx and improve their ability. Both set of players may curse foe team for bringing defense boost, but they will adapt and becomes stronger in defense boost.
If you are forced to do something which you don't like, these situations are very common and days past you will slowly forget that and make yourself comfortable in the daily routine (work life/marriage life/game life). People who doesn't get comfortable is the question here. As per the game, current portrait rewards and other things are useless. If they bring this for all levels of GEx, they can improve GEx with different rewards and make everyone happy with new changes.
So you nerfed the buildings already huh? 
Or was it an error in text in the original post. Now it's 10 FP for the serpent and 5 FP for the divine shrine (was 12 and 6)
Meanwhile we have a 40 FP Panda Shrine advertised in the new event to make the 10 FP serpent head seem underwhelming before this even hits live. Sure the temple's FP boost will work with the OP event building, but it hardly seemed like people were enthused with the permanent rewards before they became immediately outdated
Or was it an error in text in the original post. Now it's 10 FP for the serpent and 5 FP for the divine shrine (was 12 and 6) Meanwhile we have a 40 FP Panda Shrine advertised in the new event to make the 10 FP serpent head seem underwhelming before this even hits live. Sure the temple's FP boost will work with the OP event building, but it hardly seemed like people were enthused with the permanent rewards before they became immediately outdated
Sir Lancelot the Avenger
Farmer
So far, Virgo has done nothing for me, not sure about Kraken
Funnily enough every time something is too hard/bad, this theory comes up. If something is to good, it is either simply accepted or hated.
I can promise you, the intend is not to make it seem they listen, it is just testing and looking what works. Obviously the stats are too high and I hope the Game Designers see that as well and adjust it. Remember: They are also just humans and do make mistakes. However as we saw in recent events they do a lot of rebalancing for events especially before bringing it to live, all based on data and feedback and they will probably do the same here.