Feedback [Feedback] - Oceanic Future Part 4

[DeletedUser8362]

The change to the Krakken is awesome... I can't believe it has just gone from BS (as one guildmate philosophically remarked), to this now 'must have' GB in 48 hrs... Top marks to INNO... thanks for the rollercoaster from gloom to anticipation... I thought it was going to be a naff ride... but you surprised me

 

[RedRed]

Now people will have to hold off on collecting their Kraken for before a difficult battle IE get through some easy ones first then collect Kraken for harder ones.

Not really, it is enough to remove the connection from roads when you fight battles where you don't want to have this bonus.

I like the improvement on the bonuses but I have to agree with others that as it is the first bonus it's a secondary bonus; removing the "first x batles" cap maybe opens the doors to the abandon fight cheat, but there are the other 2 caps (probability of spawn and number of spawns per day). Maybe you can add a negative effect when the player surrender at first round "Kraken's revenge" (same probability but on your troops - blood must flow).

 

[DeletedUser7239]

The buff to Kracken was very nice @Zarok Dai . Don't you think the GB is a bit too small for what it offers now? FP Generation is a pretty big deal and even the % Chance of activation + FP GB Arctic Orangery is bigger than the Kracken.

I'm curious to hear the devs thoughts about the changes.

Sorry i have to disagree with you.
yes, size is smaller then artic but it gives pfs on the same basis as CDM(artic gives 1fp per level), so size is good as it is!

 

[qaccy]

Sorry i have to disagree with you.
yes, size is smaller then artic but it gives pfs on the same basis as CDM(artic gives 1fp per level), so size is good as it is!

Size isn't going to change no matter what, regardless of how anyone feels about it. What would change instead are the effects granted by that size. And for the record, if the wiki is accurate the Kraken currently follows its own progression for FP generation, below Cape/Orangery but above Hagia/CDM/Inno. Personally as I've already said I'm not a fan of yet another FP bonus on a GB, but it's certainly odd and a bit over-budget what it currently provides, considering Hagia and Inno are both larger and produce less and it produces more than a GB that's the same size.

But then again, based on your 'feedback' during the fall event it's not a surprise to me that you'd be fully in support of something that's seemingly more powerful than it should be.

 

[DeletedUser7239]

Size isn't going to change no matter what, regardless of how anyone feels about it. What would change instead are the effects granted by that size. And for the record, if the wiki is accurate the Kraken currently follows its own progression for FP generation, below Cape/Orangery but above Hagia/CDM/Inno. Personally as I've already said I'm not a fan of yet another FP bonus on a GB, but it's certainly odd and a bit over-budget what it currently provides, considering Hagia and Inno are both larger and produce less and it produces more than a GB that's the same size.

But then again, based on your 'feedback' during the fall event it's not a surprise to me that you'd be fully in support of something that's seemingly more powerful than it should be.

In the middle of so many bad choices at least a good one you do not think so? i am a fair man, when they do something good, i admit it without any problems
This GB is good, size is nice and % now is fair(fp product it is a very very nice), since it only kill ONE unit in a TWO waves fight, so to me is balanced.

 

[DeletedUser7239]

In a separated matter, anyone knows when will this come to live servers?
And anyone have the new campaign map?

 

[alm1983]

2090 of Orichalcum is too high, are many goods of

 

[DeletedUser7942]

2090 of Orichalcum is too high, are many goods of

All I ever see are people talking about needing something to do with OF goods though.

AF needed 3940 Promethium
OF2,3,4 needs 3330 3680 Orichalcum, OF5 will surely push that most likely a bit over 5000

But yeah I think they increased it, sure I had 1740 Orichalcum needed for OF4 when it was initially released now 2090.

 

[qaccy]

In the middle of so many bad choices at least a good one you do not think so? i am a fair man, when they do something good, i admit it without any problems
This GB is good, size is nice and % now is fair(fp product it is a very very nice), since it only kill ONE unit in a TWO waves fight, so to me is balanced.

This is exactly what I said in my post. The GB is a bit too good now, so you're of course thinking it's perfectly fine even though it's actually not. Even the first strike ability, looking at the numbers currently on the wiki, looks like it's going to reach a 100% occurrence around the mid-50s. Compared to all other %-based GBs that slowly climb to 100%, this is something that's completely unprecedented as none of them even come close even at much higher levels. Orangery, Seed Vault, ToR, even Atlantis all stay very far away from 100% and those effects are rather less impactful than what this GB provides and it's also smaller than all of them. The FP production just puts it over the top.

I'm not saying it isn't nice, I'm saying it's TOO nice compared to what else is in the game. The numbers were underwhelming before, now it's been swung too far in the other direction. Players may feel better about it, but objectively speaking it's just as unbalanced now as it was when it was first released. That, or now most other GBs are unbalanced ans should be readjusted to reach the Kraken's level of effect.

@Zarok Dai Oh, and one thing I'd like to mention! Really glad to see no research in this release that's nothing but avatars. Having forced research in OF3 that unlocked nothing but avatars was one of the big things I didn't like about the age so far. Related, but when an avatar is unlocked through research would it be possible for the game to display what avatar(s) you obtained? To my knowledge the avatar list isn't really sorted, so it can be hard to tell sometimes which ones are new or where they are in the list.

 

[xivarmy]

All I ever see are people talking about needing something to do with OF goods though.

AF needed 3940 Promethium
OF2,3,4 needs 3330 3680 Orichalcum, OF5 will surely push that most likely a bit over 5000

But yeah I think they increased it, sure I had 1740 Orichalcum needed for OF4 when it was initially released now 2090.

Probably just different perspectives - it's easy to get OF goods for many of us from quests, and with no sink for them they consequently have no trade value. But the research costs don't really make a difference to that as the people who have difficulty fulfilling them also don't tend to have anything to trade for them - not many people will buy goods for research with FP. The new building will help a lot though - should be enough if the reaction to orangery is any indication. Ideally those more casual folks would make the FE and AF goods we want to trade for (and are even offering more OF for) instead of making yet more OF and trading for other OF but that just doesn't happen all that much.

The main takeaway if i were a dev would be a need for an optional-but-desirable unlimited goods sink in every age. You know that role that 2 ages ago was filled by GvG. That way the 'i just research stuff' folks wouldn't be overburdened, and those putting in effort into optimising their output feel there's a use for it (i.e. at least my goods have enough value to trade down for goods i can use for GvG or sell or whatever). It'd also be wise to stop making horribly easy to complete recurrings that take almost no city space but i don't know how you put that genie back in the bottle since i know i'd be irritated if moving from OF->whatever's after OF my quest ability went down... And I'd also be irritated if i was just newly AF/OF with the intention of running those quests and they got fixed. It's not good for the game though that i can do 1000 quests a day if i have the time and patience.

 

[DeletedUser]

Related, but when an avatar is unlocked through research would it be possible for the game to display what avatar(s) you obtained? To my knowledge the avatar list isn't really sorted, so it can be hard to tell sometimes which ones are new or where they are in the list.

I agree. It has been brought up before but I will mention it again on Monday to the higher ups, thanks

 

[DeletedUser7942]

This is exactly what I said in my post. The GB is a bit too good now, so you're of course thinking it's perfectly fine even though it's actually not. Even the first strike ability, looking at the numbers currently on the wiki, looks like it's going to reach a 100% occurrence around the mid-50s. Compared to all other %-based GBs that slowly climb to 100%, this is something that's completely unprecedented as none of them even come close even at much higher levels. Orangery, Seed Vault, ToR, even Atlantis all stay very far away from 100% and those effects are rather less impactful than what this GB provides and it's also smaller than all of them. The FP production just puts it over the top.

I'm not saying it isn't nice, I'm saying it's TOO nice compared to what else is in the game. The numbers were underwhelming before, now it's been swung too far in the other direction. Players may feel better about it, but objectively speaking it's just as unbalanced now as it was when it was first released. That, or now most other GBs are unbalanced ans should be readjusted to reach the Kraken's level of effect.

But the main limiting factor is the amount of fights and while better than the initial release 2 possible out of 10 fights is nothing in GvG, 20 out of 20 is better but still 20 GvG fights is nothing. GE and PvP maybe different story, maybe they can make it more for GvG while making it less for PvP and GE.

 

[xivarmy]

But the main limiting factor is the amount of fights and while better than the initial release 2 possible out of 10 fights is nothing in GvG, 20 out of 20 is better but still 20 GvG fights is nothing. GE and PvP maybe different story, maybe they can make it more for GvG while making it less for PvP and GE.

I doubt targetting a GB towards being balanced for people who do hundreds of fights a day is a good thing... 20 fights reliably is going to be more important to the average player than hit or miss for 500 fights for ghost gvg grinders. Say you wind up with 50 instakills spread out over that period by making it a 10%-ish chance instead of the first 20 fights being near-guaranteed. You've made it remarkably worse for the light fighters in the name of making it slightly less of a minor deal for people who didn't really need the help to do 500 fights a day anyways! (for the record i fall in both categories at times, when i do gvg i'm setup and capable for doing hundreds a day - but i find it tedious and boring and enjoy the game more when i just fight some hoodies and expedition)

 

[qaccy]

But the main limiting factor is the amount of fights and while better than the initial release 2 possible out of 10 fights is nothing in GvG, 20 out of 20 is better but still 20 GvG fights is nothing. GE and PvP maybe different story, maybe they can make it more for GvG while making it less for PvP and GE.

To be fair, I don't think this GB was ever designed with GvG in mind. Alcatraz already takes care of that pretty well by providing more troops than you can realistically use anywhere else and I don't think there's any version of the Kraken's bonus that would be 'fair' for GvG while not being completely insane for other areas of the game where you can battle.

 

[DeletedUser7942]

To be fair, I don't think this GB was ever designed with GvG in mind. Alcatraz already takes care of that pretty well by providing more troops than you can realistically use anywhere else and I don't think there's any version of the Kraken's bonus that would be 'fair' for GvG while not being completely insane for other areas of the game where you can battle.

The version of Kraken I'm thinking of can split the number per area, for GvG you would get more fights, less for GE and PvP but I'm feelin the too hard programming excuse comin for that one lol, well yeah now after it's developed

 

[qaccy]

The version of Kraken I'm thinking of can split the number per area, for GvG you would get more fights, less for GE and PvP but I'm feelin the too hard programming excuse comin for that one lol, well yeah now after it's developed

I'll counter instead that there doesn't need to be any distinction for GvG in the first place. Is the bonus really that meaningful in typical GvG gameplay? When you're actually attacking another guild time is the most important factor, and the Kraken's bonus isn't going to be saving you any time in a situation where you're primarily auto-battling with rogues against relatively weak and stupid troops. GE has large bonuses where killing a unit can actually have a significant impact, in the continent map the troops are relatively weak as well but the smarter AI somewhat counteracts that, and the neighborhood is kind of a mixed bag where you never really know what you're going to be facing. Essentially, I see the Kraken as being more beneficial in areas where you're more likely to fight manually, and GvG is not that place.

 

[DeletedUser7942]

I'll counter instead that there doesn't need to be any distinction for GvG in the first place. Is the bonus really that meaningful in typical GvG gameplay? When you're actually attacking another guild time is the most important factor, and the Kraken's bonus isn't going to be saving you any time in a situation where you're primarily auto-battling with rogues against relatively weak and stupid troops. GE has large bonuses where killing a unit can actually have a significant impact, in the continent map the troops are relatively weak as well but the smarter AI somewhat counteracts that, and the neighborhood is kind of a mixed bag where you never really know what you're going to be facing. Essentially, I see the Kraken as being more beneficial in areas where you're more likely to fight manually, and GvG is not that place.

No need to counter with anything, not everyone plays the same so Kraken may be more useful in GvG to some than others, same for PvP, GE and cMap. If they could make Kraken apply to these area separately as opposed to lumping them all together and trying to balance a GB around that lump then I think it would make more sense.

 

[DeletedUser7585]

Kraken animation: http://gph.is/2fyjxGs

Love that GIF of Kraken thx. ~┗(-_-)┛~

 

[DeletedUser7585]

The skill does not work on defense, only on attack. So if you have The Kraken and someone attacks you, the enemy cannot get hit with that ability. You have to start the battle for the chance for the First Strike to be there.

Ouch so again the attacker has the big advantage. I think the devs should have taken that into consideration if both have the Kraken then the defense should be able to protect themselves as well. Now as far as Kraken working for defense with non Kraken attacker then I believe it should be turned off.

 

[DeletedUser7585]

Has it been posted yet when The Kraken will be available on the Live servers? If not can someone guesstamate roughly when it might be available?