Feedback Forge Bowl 2019 - Closing Thoughts

[Frankiedk]

YES, you should have finished the event and that's that. Not for adding useless (nor useful) stuff to your inventory, you have live server for such decisions. You should finish it because it is testing server and you should test the event till the very end. No matter what you THOUGHT will/will not happen, what you thought you will/will not achieve or get as reward. But for testing purposes. Plain and simple. If you do not like it, don't play on testing server. You signed up to be testing and you are being paid for it (those free diamonds for each event). If you are not willing to test the events to the end, you should quit beta or at least stop crying that you didn't finish it because you THOUGHT of XYZ.

You of course, might not like some of the events and you might choose not to participate in them or you might choose not to finish them. Then enjoy the free diamonds and don'r complain about YOUR OWN CHOICE (or did anyone force you not to finish?)



Nope... That sentence should read: If I had done what I was supposed to do and what I have been paid to do for 5 more minutes, then ....
You've made your choice (like many others I assume...). Live with it.

Ohhh Boy did you miss my point...

I don't care that i didn't get the complete Statue.
I don't care that i missed out on the last task or the last 2 touchdowns
I don't care what you think, about what i should and shouldn't do.

What i do care about is that they changed the rules AFTER i had to opportunity to change MY mind. Not acceptable...

I do like the fact they changed the event for Live, so i can obtain the statue on my live servers, with high likelihood without using diamonds. But i hate that they made a terrible attempt to fix the problem, by handing everyone a numbered set of upgrade kits. That's not the way to do it. Some were missing 1, some 2 and apparently like me, some were missing 3 or more, so instead of owning up to their change and give everyone the same, "gift" they opted to open up for unequal gifting, for some it was fantastic, for some not so much...

Inno may be paying me Diamonds on Beta to do the events, but when they do a pointless event, i do i NO WAY feel obligated to finish it, as JTucker implies that i got paid to do the event. So if they do a bad Event, i WILL do a bad job of testing it... Paid or not...

Funny thing, last time a had a major meltdown after an event here on Beta, they actually started informing us of changes to the events. Maybe after this they will change this unacceptable behavior as well, they might pay us, but we do test and, information goes both ways, so next time.

FIX BALANCING BEFORE THE EVENT IS DONE, IT RAN FOR 20+ DAYS.....

 

[DeletedUser]

What i do care about is that they changed the rules

What rules? Is there a Beta Testing Manifesto somewhere that I don't know about?
The fact is changing the balancing of any content before it's release is what Beta is for, it has nothing to do with rules.
We also are neither obligated, nor can guarantee, that changes will still not be coming after an event in this case has technically ended on Beta. Even once an event has ended here, as long as it is still not on the live servers, then it is still in testing and subject to change.

but when they do a pointless event, i do i NO WAY feel obligated to finish it

And that is your choice. We aren't forcing anyone to engage in our testing process, we just appreciate the efforts of those that do

 

[Frankiedk]

What rules? Is there a Beta Testing Manifesto somewhere that I don't know about?
The fact is changing the balancing of any content before it's release is what Beta is for, it has nothing to do with rules.
We also are neither obligated, nor can guarantee, that changes will still not be coming after an event in this case has technically ended on Beta. Even once an event has ended here, as long as it is still not on the live servers, then it is still in testing and subject to change.

First off... THIS PROBLEM is in NO WAY related to Beta, Bugs, Software or development. THIS is a Inno Games Political indecision issue. FACT.

You have no rules???? YOU may call it game play, but game play is a set of rules. FACT.

FoE Bowl event... Pointless to finish as i didn't want a scaffold placed in my city... Now AFTER the event has finished, you changed the rules of the event, which i fully understand, as its gone from pointless to interesting event, after its unavailable, now i cannot finish the no longer pointless event... Is that a rule change? It sure is... I cannot re-enable the event, i cannot spend the footballs i had, if you have no rules i should really be able to do that... But i cannot, as this is the Game Play/rules of FoE, that i cannot just add, enable or disable stuff.

What i would like is for the BETA announcement to state if Diamonds are required to "Finish" the event YOU HAVE THIS INFORMATION as the event is designed this way, WHY do we have to find out for our selves? And then we can start discussing it from Event day 1, YOU KNOW ITS AN ISSUE EVERY TIME YOU MAKE THE DECISION TO NOT "GIVE" THE FULL MAIN PRIZE, so you then have the length of the event to get you political ducks in a row... And if you want to do FURTHER changes after it finishes on Beta, that's fine by me, but please compensate equally or not at all, after all this is beta so we have no say, the compensation from this event is useless for me, because you changed the game-play after the event had finished. Make a decision and stick to it, and to change it 3, 4 or 5 days after it finished is NOT SOFTWARE OR DEVELOPMENT RELATED, THAT IS 100% YOUR OWN POLITICAL INDECISION. YOU HAD 3 WEEK TO CHANGE THE EVENT (The rules of the Event)
What changed in the days after the event, that made you go from NO to YES, that could not have been changed before it finished? You had CLEARLY decided not to, BEFORE the event even started, you CLEARLY stated it would NOT change, as it hadn't changed after the first round of changes... THAT'S what i have a problem with, that I am a victim of your political indecision, and NOT bugs, software or development related errors. And YES its because i didn't finish, but that decision was based on your Event Rules/Game-Play when it was enabled. You decided NOT to give the full Colossus, so i opted not to put a L9 Colossus in stock. Now have EXACTLY what i DID NOT WANT... A L9 Colossus in stock...

But thankfully the Colossus is not a new building, and it often appears in events, so i will just get the missing upgrade for it in the next event, just like i did with my level 8 Tholos... Ohhh, no that's never been available after that event, then this one probably never will too... Great, do i delete, and then it reappears in a later event, or do i leave it, and wait for it never to appear... No matter what decision i make, its the wrong one...

I FULLY understand this is Beta and nothing is sure as it is development in progress, but one thing is Development, another is political decisions, like this one, and all i ask is, if you pay me diamonds to test the event, please tell EVERYTHING in the announcements, so there is not doubt when we will need to have the "get the main prize" discussion, and you can make a final decision BEFORE the Event it concerns has finished...

And regarding SCAFFOLDING, who made the decision that Tower of Babel is now under permanent scaffolding... GOOD DECISION, do i just live with that, and hope they someday finish it, or do i straight, tear it down now? I do like the new "St. Mark" and "Castel del Monte", but Tower of Babel scaffolding is UGLY...

 

[DeletedUser]

THIS PROBLEM is in NO WAY related to Beta, Bugs, Software or development. THIS is a Inno Games Political indecision issue. FACT.

It had everything to do with Beta, bugs and software. And what does politics have to do with a game company changing it's code during a testing phase? So this statement is your opinion, it does not make it fact.

if you pay me diamonds to test the event

We do not 'pay' anyone on Beta to test. We reward free diamonds as a gesture to those that take their time and volunteer to help us test. Never have we suggested how or where or when you can use those diamonds. It is each players choice. You chose where and when to use diamonds.

please tell EVERYTHING in the announcements

We put in the announcements what we need to. Has it occurred to you that we may be testing more than the code in new content? Maybe we also want to observe how players perceive the content, how they discover it and interact with it, and how they feel about it. There is a lot more to testing than just finding bugs in the code.

With that said, there is really nothing further to discuss in relation to this event. We tested it, fixed bugs, changed balancing, and gave away free stuff. We aren't going to do anything further with it.

Thanks for all the feedback everyone

 

[Frankiedk]

My God, you once again COMPLETELY missed the whole point of my post. I accepted LONG ago, that i am not getting the Colossus, and that is NOT what my feedback is about.

To say this is "changing code" is beyond a stretch...

And as you cannot read between the lines, i will have to tell you what My feedback is literally. Your indecisiveness, makes you look like a bunch of amateurs, and the way you handled it is hopeless. But happy that you changed you mind for Live.

 

[dolphin]

It had everything to do with Beta, bugs and software. And what does politics have to do with a game company changing it's code during a testing phase? So this statement is your opinion, it does not make it fact.



We do not 'pay' anyone on Beta to test. We reward free diamonds as a gesture to those that take their time and volunteer to help us test. Never have we suggested how or where or when you can use those diamonds. It is each players choice. You chose where and when to use diamonds.



We put in the announcements what we need to. Has it occurred to you that we may be testing more than the code in new content? Maybe we also want to observe how players perceive the content, how they discover it and interact with it, and how they feel about it. There is a lot more to testing than just finding bugs in the code.

With that said, there is really nothing further to discuss in relation to this event. We tested it, fixed bugs, changed balancing, and gave away free stuff. We aren't going to do anything further with it.

Thanks for all the feedback everyone

Why don't you resign?

EDIT: NormaJeane - 2019-01-19 - inapproprate/disrespectful language​

 

[DeletedUser9746]

I'm not saying it is right or wrong. But I am saying that as it is a test server, to test the game, to find bugs and glitches...
You choose to play at your own risk. And you are not entitled to special treatment simply because you choose the beta server over the live server.

And honestly having myself done these for a couple decades now, with games, apps, OS's etc? You are not entitled to anything. Not even to have your complaints taken seriously. Unless otherwise stated? You are not entitled to compensation, or live communication (like this forum) or even access to an email address to send bugs to. Those are all options exercised by the developer. They don't even owe you an explanation for why they chose path A instead of Path B...

We are just guests invited into the developers home to view home movies being edited into family albums. We can be asked to leave at any time. We can BYO (booze, food, snacks) unless they have been offered. Even then? If they run out you don't have the right to demand they run to the store for more...

Just saying is all... You don't have to like it... Doesn't mean its still not true...

I sense severe burns & disappointments in your past experiences with these test servers, but just one point:
Who says anyone would really bother to take care of your complaints on the live servers?!
There's a risk there too to get neglected by the customer support people...
So far, things here have been acceptable & reasonable for me.

 

[FrejaSP]

Why don't you resign? You are doing a ****ty job!

That's your opinion. I find Zarok are doing a fine job putting up with people like you
Now stop crying and treat others as you want them to treat you.

 

[Thunderdome]

@i2mcabre you're making me hungry. I do get your point but I must stretch it a bit further with this following example:

• One goes to a movie theater because a movie comes out and they wanted to see it. Advertisement and Invitation.
• The movie theater offers food and items for a price that sometimes it's over priced. Profit and Making Money.
• The movie goer brings their own food and drink to save up on costs, but the theater frowns on such. Loss of Profit.
• If the movie is good, the movie goer is happy. Satisfaction and Repeat Process.
• If the movie is bad, the movie goer is disappointed. Foregone and Termination.

Yes, we might be invited to test out something, but if things were spelled out or adjusted before the event had ended, we can make those sound decisions on how to proceed that test or event. I just read about a guy (gonna assume such) that stopped doing the event because not all of the information was present at the time. I care not for the diamond rewards given for each time an event or release comes out, but I could feel the same if disappointment is around the corner without an adjustment or fix in sight (or if they fixed it very marginally that gives us that sense that nothing has changed).

And bottom line, if a host invites people into their home and serves food, they must ensure that it gets stocked so the guests don't leave in disappointment. If there were no food served, then no one will know of the difference.

@dolphin you and I may not see eye to eye on majority of the things, but that one question that could not escape me remains: what are you doing here?

You say a moderator/community member isn't doing their job, but truth be told I had seen this person tried their best in ensuring we get heard/read and had done their best to relay any (late most of the time) information that might be of use. Yes, I was fairly disappointed as things were made at the "last minute" and after the event has terminated on the beta server, regardless that I spent for diamonds (and no, I am not going to cry on that as it is my choice and prerogative in doing so). However, I can see somewhat an improvement on the live server (no diamonds spent and somehow wind up in the Gold league) but I won't hold my breath on it until the very end.

Still, I had done Zarok's job before in other game forum based sites, so I know how it is like when you're the point of contact in trying to be the middle-person between players and developers. And, trust me, I know how to deal with people that often leave them in the spotlight while I move on to other things (if you get what I mean).

 

[DeletedUser9537]

And bottom line, if a host invites people into their home and serves food, they must ensure that it gets stocked so the guests don't leave in disappointment. If there were no food served, then no one will know of the difference.

Nope, Nuh Uh, Not gonna happen. A host can plan to feed 30 people and invite 10. Ten people can eat enough for forty people... The host is most certainly not required to go out and buy more...

The bottom line on that is if you are invited and you eat all the food... And you are disappointed because there were no leftovers for you to take home? Toodles Buckaroo! Do let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!

To address your movie scenario... If you pay to watch the editor splice the film together? You do not get to complain because you saw the spoilers...

To quote an oldie but a goodie...

• You take the good, you take the bad,
• you take them both and there you have
• The facts of life, the facts of life.

• There's a time you got to go and show
• You're growin' now you know about
• The facts of life, the facts of life.

• When the world never seems
• to be livin up to your dreams
• And suddenly you're finding out
• the facts of life are all about you, you.

• It takes a lot to get 'em right
• When you're learning the facts of life. (learning the facts of life)
• Learning the facts of life (learning the facts of life)
• Learning the facts of life.

 

[DeletedUser9537]

I sense severe burns & disappointments in your past experiences with these test servers,

I've fried my share of video and sound cards... Even a couple of Motherboards over the years... That is a part of the risk that you take when you choose to participate in "Beta" anything. I have never been "Burned" by anyone nor disappointed by any of my experiences. Because... If it becomes apparent that I am not going to enjoy the process anymore?

I simply STOP participating... Easy Breasy... Nice and Peasy...

but just one point:
Who says anyone would really bother to take care of your complaints on the live servers?!
There's a risk there too to get neglected by the customer support people...
So far, things here have been acceptable & reasonable for me.

If I were on a live server playing the "Official" release and I had a problem or complaint that Customer Service refused to address? I would simply STOP participating... Maybe give them a scathing Yelp review...

My one question for you is:

What's your point?
If you are happy here... So far...
What's complaint do you have against my responding to what IMO are silly complaints by others?

 

[Thunderdome]

Although, if you do invite 10 people and 30 others joined, you had to prepare for such because everyone will invite their brother, sister, and cousin too. I cannot just go and tell everyone that I only invited 10 people, now can I? That's pretty much how my house parties have been. People wind up taking leftovers home but had a good time in the process. Now, if I didn't provide any food and had announced it ahead of time (as I do have some meetings that food isn't required), then I am sure the right amount of people will join.

As to the movie bit, if they made the "hype" that brings all to the yard, then yeah. However, some were "snipe" that left people disappointed and asking that one question, "what in the @*$#*# did I just watch?" Myself, now with movie shootings going about these days, I just wait until it gets to YouTube and check the comments to determine if I want to watch it. Win for me.

 

[DeletedUser8277]

I was so happy to see the changes they made to this going live I some bought diamonds when the deal came up to show my appreciation that beta users were heard. I don't mind supporting the game when I can, although I'm certainly far away from whale numbers, I just don't like needing to buy diamonds to be able to finish a single event building.

I still don't understand why people are complaining about us being given the thank you of the upgrades after the fact. It makes zero sense to me, you spent diamonds because you chose to. Stop buying diamonds on beta if you're going to act like that, you know the risks everything is subject to change on the beta server. Some people are perfectly happy with the gamble (and the much lower cost of diamonds here than on live) if you're not one of them then don't do it and then blame others for your choices. @Zarok Dai , who is a great community manager by the way, and if you don't think she is spend a day on the US forum where the CM stops in once a month only to post an announcement and reads nothing, went out of her way to advocate for us and got us those upgrades. All you're doing is showing everyone no good dead goes unpunished and making sure they wont bother to fix things for us in the future. Zarok please don't let a few spoiled apples ruin the appreciation the vast majority of players have for you and for the upgrades we were given. I spent diamonds on beta too for this event I don't expect a single one back and I am more than happy the event was made better for live players and I was later given the upgrades to finish the building.