King Flush
Marquis
may I ask how you go about getting historic data for players? I only know of ForgeDB which isn't up to date and scoredb which only seems to show last 30 days of data.
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Discussion Guild Battlegrounds Watchtower and Siege Camp Ability Re-balance
- Thread starter Juber
- Start date
King Flush
Marquis
okay so I didn't play pre GBG but what the hell did people do back then? I just don't see there is much to the game other than that.it already survived 7 years without GBG
In any case, I'd hazard a guess that Inno have made more money in the days of GBG than the time before, correct me if I'm wrong.
Markus Stormrider
Regent
well apparently the change is not coming to live servers this week otherwise it would have been announced already. but let's see what happens now and in two weeks
Emberguard
Emperor
Yeah that's the biggest reason for concern. The fact that no matter what anyone thinks about it, it's a massive change.
CrashBoom
Legend
so 2 more weeks the same people writing the same things in the beta forum about itwell apparently the change is not coming to live servers this week otherwise it would have been announced already. but let's see what happens now and in two weeks
Emberguard
Emperor
Guild Battlegrounds was introduced just before the pandemic hit. If Guild Battlegrounds had never been introduced there would have been a increase in revenue simply because the pandemic brought more people online looking for stuff to do. So we can't prove you wrong, but we also can't prove adding Guild Battlegrounds gave more revenue than if they had designed it differently or omitted it entirely
CrashBoom
Legend
and in the year before GBG they made more money than 2 years before that
and 2 years before GBG they made more money than 3 years before
so what does that prove ?
Pericles the Lion
Emperor
I used the 31-Oct-21 ForgeDB amount at the start point and ScoreDB 2-Jul-22 as the end point for 8-month base, Used ScoreDB for the last 30 days.
King Flush
Marquis
not sure how much that really tells the tale if you're looking at lower ranked players in 6 months they may be a whole lot stronger which might account for any increase in fight numbers, unless you can view their stats just before the nerf then afterwards I don't think you can make a fair comparison.
CrashBoom
Legend
Inno could prove that the revenue drops drastically after they go live with it and look at the numbers after 6 month
and if that is the case they definitely will change it back
jovada
Regent
People seems to forget GbG was designed for battle between guilds, strong guilds could reach diamond and the rewards for reaching diamond was a graduating of rewards like 5 fp in gold , 7 in platina and 10 in diamond. So a strong guild in diamond can have double of rewards then a weak guild in gold.
Three mistakes were done, and some of the mistakes we (i'm not the only one) pointed out almost right from the start, the 0 attrition by using 5 camps, the (dis)advantage of the random slots and later on the matchmaking.
Now finaly inno is doing something to correct GbG, first step is taken by cancelling the 0 attrition , i hope they do something also for matchmaking and something about the random slots.
I agree that 66.6% limit attrition is maybe to much and for gameplay of active players could be 75 or 80
Those players who always wait till they can fight with 0 attrition they also will wait till they can fight with 80% and all those big fighters who claimed they are strong can all reach 100 attrition and so can do 400 fights a day , and you may shout whatever you want but that still gives a huge amount of rewards and double of the same fights if you were in gold.
@Pericles the Lion you are right the top 3 or 4 abusers in a guild will suffer but the middleplayer in that same guild will gain fights, we see it and another player from a big guild said the same that his fights were going up and before was stopped by the whales of his guild.
I wonder what excuse the whales or often the leaders use to their lesser guildmates, " we have to wait before we jump in because if we spend attrition in the beginning we will not be able to swap 10 sectors a day and i'm online all day and set timers ( so i'm sure i can do the fights and no lesser guildmate)"
Whatever excuse or argument they bring it's only for one reason and it's not gameplay.
Three mistakes were done, and some of the mistakes we (i'm not the only one) pointed out almost right from the start, the 0 attrition by using 5 camps, the (dis)advantage of the random slots and later on the matchmaking.
Now finaly inno is doing something to correct GbG, first step is taken by cancelling the 0 attrition , i hope they do something also for matchmaking and something about the random slots.
I agree that 66.6% limit attrition is maybe to much and for gameplay of active players could be 75 or 80
Those players who always wait till they can fight with 0 attrition they also will wait till they can fight with 80% and all those big fighters who claimed they are strong can all reach 100 attrition and so can do 400 fights a day , and you may shout whatever you want but that still gives a huge amount of rewards and double of the same fights if you were in gold.
@Pericles the Lion you are right the top 3 or 4 abusers in a guild will suffer but the middleplayer in that same guild will gain fights, we see it and another player from a big guild said the same that his fights were going up and before was stopped by the whales of his guild.
I wonder what excuse the whales or often the leaders use to their lesser guildmates, " we have to wait before we jump in because if we spend attrition in the beginning we will not be able to swap 10 sectors a day and i'm online all day and set timers ( so i'm sure i can do the fights and no lesser guildmate)"
Whatever excuse or argument they bring it's only for one reason and it's not gameplay.
King Flush
Marquis
proof or not I still imagine GBG has been a cash cow for them, everyone I know who has spent money on the game buying diamonds has been for GBG not so much to spend on SC's etc but to spend on events to get buildings that will help with GBG.
Apparently (so I hear) it's the quite young players that buy the diamonds which would fit with this theory and my own personal experience, but why would anyone post nerf spend money on doing the same when there will be such minimal gain from doing so?
I hear people say Inno's turn over is of no concern to me or other players but don't kid yourself this nerf will be in principle done in the hope to make more money, maybe they think changing to a more negotiation than fighting based GBG will encourage more diamond spending to pay for the extra turns but I doubt very much players will be so inclined if the general interest GBG falls through the floor which I'm sure will be what will happen.
for sure, If they bring it in I see this being the most likely scenario but a lot of damage could be done by then that may not easily be reversed by just changing it back, already Inno have a reputation for not listening to their players and creating such a lack of trust from Inno and it's customers can't be a good thing, I for one feel coned having spent money on the game in the belief that it will improve the game for me to now realise what I bought was pretty much useless.Inno could prove that the revenue drops drastically after they go live with it and look at the numbers after 6 month
and if that is the case they definitely will change it back
King Flush
Marquis
just don't agree with anything you say other than the matchmaking
Emberguard
Emperor
Same reason you already gave for GBG: to advance their gameplay. That was the reason before GBG even existed.
I can understand that won’t make sense to you because you‘re basing the value of what you can buy based on GBG with 0 attrition. That’s fine. But the reason hasn’t really changed from what it was prior, just the focus.
Pericles the Lion
Emperor
I didn't say "lower ranked" but, like I said, "quick and dirty". However, I agree that there is a strong likelihood that the mid-range players got stronger in the 8 months prior to 2-Jul (and maybe during the past 30 days). But, any gains in strength are accounted for in the fight counts for the 8-month base interval. What is not accounted for is any strength gained during the past 30 days. Additional A/D% would result in more fights but 2X? For multiple players? I think that it is more likely the top fighters maxxed out on attrition and the mid-level fighters were able to pick up the slack.
King Flush
Marquis
I would definitely not have spent money on this game had GBG been as it's intended post nerf as it would be obvious that the money would do very little to 'advance gameplay', I don't even know what gameplay there is post nerf, yes people played before GBG I've asked as to why as I don't get what there was to take from playing back then (genuinely interested) and sure people will continue to play thereafter (those that like dull games I guess) but I'm sure the players who desire something a little more from their games will not bother with it.
think we can make a few fundamental points - competitive players (whether they be new or advanced players) don't like the nerf, competitive players are those most likely to purchase diamonds. do the math.
Pericles the Lion
Emperor
A classic "Who Moved My Cheese" example.Inno could prove that the revenue drops drastically after they go live with it and look at the numbers after 6 month
and if that is the case they definitely will change it back
Pericles the Lion
Emperor
I've been playing for 628 days, am ranked 218 on my main world (356MM points, 250K battles), 1800/1100 A/D%, and in a top guild. I think I pass the litmus test for being "competitive". I am also the antithesis to your "fundamental point". I have been F2P for over a year (ever since INNO introduced the "Heal All" button). I spend diamonds but do not buy them. I do not disagree with the change to SC/WT. I'm fairly certain that I am not alone.
King Flush
Marquis
being in a top guild, everybody in our guild has the ability to get much more fights now than what would be permittable post nerf some still choose not to but this is not because the top fighters take all the fights and they don't get a look in, but because they choose not to be that active, I get good numbers, why is that? is it because I fight so fast? - no, I really don't and not like I even try to hit sectors like there's no tomorrow usually spend more time managing the map, so if someone putting in 50% effort into actually fighting gets good numbers then everybody has scope to at least match my numbers.
Pericles the Lion
Emperor
You are referring to the live world. I'm talking about what is happening on Beta.